what is something you feel you can’t say in church, or around other christians?
for example…mine would be, “sometimes i feel like i can’t share how i really feel inside.”
funny, serious, whatever…what’s yours?
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That sometimes when we are at churches trying to raise support, I totally go comando. Yup…I do- and I can’t let anybody in on that secret. But here, let me tell you and all your readers. Ha ha. This is like post secret Anne. Yay for you and your crazy ideas.
That sometimes when there is a dramatic pause in my message, and I look like I’m waiting on God to give me something really powerful to say, I’m not. In reality I’m just wondering if I zipped up my zipper before I went up on stage.
I’d rather look like a good christian than put in the time and effort to actually be one.
nothing – i typically let it all out, and 99.9% of the time I’m absolutely correct
it’s great being me! (for those of you that are the J type, this is a JOKE!!)
btw Pete, I’m the guy on the third row that yells out – “pete, you fly’s unzipped – good to see you too buddy!
that comb-over really does need to go. someone might lose an eye on a windy day! if the church can change…you can too…!
…I just had a drink last night and it tasted really good.
You rock, ’cause God didn’t have time to create a nobody and you are awesome!
…that I support civil unions for homosexual couples.
I currently feel NO connection to God when I pray or read the bible.
[side note: my only current connection to Him spiritually seems to be through worship]
http://www.vagabondrunn.wordpress.com
That I hate Facing the Giants.
I don’t often tell anybody what I really believe about women in ministry – it’s too heavy for most people and honestly, I think most don’t want to hear it. So I keep my mouth shut alot – but not on your blog, Anne! Nobody knows me here! haha
I’m repulsed by the “fakeness” of people that have caught the “big-smile-church bug”. You might be acting like you care at this moment, but a few seconds later you are going to stab me in the back…
Um…how I’m really doing that day or feeling at the time.
Christy Christian..”Hey jen, How are you today?”
Me…..um….”fine!” and you?
Plastic people.
Instead….”I’m alive. :) I’d love to have someone pray for me today. I’m struggling with (fill in the blank) and I could use an accountability partner.”
When I say “I’ll pray for you.” I don’t usually mean it. I have been a Christian for 27 years and I still don’t understand the point of praying.
ditto ann, and i will be voting for hillary if she’s the nominee.
I would say “I really am thinking I can’t do this job anymoreâ€. I am allowing the ministry that I serve become the job I don’t enjoy.
I like to swear. It makes me feel better.
I have others but too many people I know read your blog and I’m too chicken to share.
oh, and i really really like amy winehouse.
I struggle with having a quiet time. I’ve been a “Christian” since I was 6 years old and sometimes I wonder if I really am a Christian and why I don’t seem to have it all together.
I’m a pacifist.
I am petrified by impromptu prayer OUT LOUD.
If you can clap and yell for the Cowboys or Stars or Mavs or Tennessee Lady Vols or whoever, why can’t you clap or cheer for Jesus during worship.
I would also say that I suck at following thru. It can be following thru with reading my bible, praying for people,or calling people, etc.
I thank God that loves me and uses me, imperfections and all.
We do too much in “the name of Jesus,” and I truthfully think that most of what we do repulses Jesus.
i dont pray for meals because i dont see the point in it.
Most people I know who claim to follow God are really sucky people who don’t care about anything but themselves and their comfort. It makes me not want to follow their rules.
lately, i have had several people come to me to complain/chew about things that don’t involve me…. so mine would be “I DON’T CARE!”
I’m a socialist…and I hate the worship industry.
I dislike 99% of the Christian music out there. I also dislike 88% of the worship music out there…picky picky
“How is the God of the New Testament love, yet in the Old Testament he committed genocide and commanded His people to kill off anyone who was in their way (women and children included)?â€
I should be able to ask that in a church forum, but I feel immature for thinking it. I have been a Christian my whole life, so it feels like I should be over these kinds of conflicts.
Sometimes I am afraid to say that serving in ministry is not always a joy.
‘not all Christians are republicans’
Sometimes I wonder if this whole Christianity thing is a lie.
When I’m leading worship, I sometimes think of all 31 flavors of ice cream at Baskin Robbins.
How I feel more alone than ever, when someone gets up to the mic and talks about the deep friendships that can be found in church small/care groups . . . and that just has NOT been my experience.
“Do you like Corona or Red Stripe?”
Sometimes i feel like what i am teaching is having no effect on anybody! :(
I would like to say:
“Your 14/15/16/17/18 year old daughter looks like a SLUT in those Abercrombie shirts & jeans. They are too tight & low & her boobs are falling out and her pubic hair is peaking out from the top of her jeans. All the young teenage boys are going crazy and probably older men are lusting after your child – CHILD. Get a Frick’n clue & teach her some modesty or perhaps you yourself are so caught up in the latest fashion that you don’t care if your daughter dresses like a SLUT”
…and no – i’m not an old ugly women that is clueless about life, and yes, this is a good battle to pick.
There – that’s what I would say.
That I rarely have a quiet time. Stop looking at my hot husband. :)
I was in a group of more than 20 people, coed, when I told everybody that I used to work in porn.
So, there is nothing I will or will not say in church.
Anne, if you admitted that to me, my initial response (with all sorts of glee) would be, “Wanna read together? Do you have questions? I would love to help you out!”
This, of course, totally forgetting my place as a single guy and you as a married woman… but still.
“No”
(as a response to another serving/leading “opportunity”)
“Balance”
Billary and Bammamamma are from satan – there, I said it
… isn’t that the purpose of James 5:16?
TONY – did you say
Hillary & Obama?
Just wanted a clarification.
my son asked me a few days ago “are democrats bad”? I overcame the temptation and told him the truth. I love those truly teachable moments.
I’ll leave my temptation & truth open for argument…hahaha. I have decided that that subject is best left in the house.
How come pastors don’t live what they teach?
Anne,
Too often I say the thing or things that I “can’t” and then I have to clean up the mess. But God has a big broom.
brianalexander.wordpress.com
That law is easier than grace … just tell me what to do and not do and I’ll give it my best shot.
Grace is too big, to wide open and scary.
(And I’ve said this–and people laugh and think I’m kidding–but I’m not.)
http://www.theaccidentalpharisee.blogspot.com
I’m depressed- and it’s not because of a relationship with Jesus.
I don’t like Beth Moore Studies.
(a lack of relationship with Jesus. oops)
well. um. i pray SO LITTLE that its probably more accurate to say i don’t pray.
I don’t like boisterous worship where every week there’s a new song.
…”stop whining about your awful life and DO something about it – kill yourself, I don’t care, I’m tired of listening to you and taking care of you and being a ’supportive christian friend’” That’s really bad isn’t it? Yeh, it is.
yep – both of ‘em. (but, this is about things we say we wish we could take back) – but I probably won’t regardless
mine is usually “man, I can’t stand Christians sometimes.”
I really, really like a good glass of red, spicy wine. I think most folks in church do drink responsibily, we are all just too scared to say it.
Also: “get off your butts and praise the God that saved you from all sin and shame!!!”
thanks for asking anne! I feel so relieved now.
quit your bitc….complaining.
so how much are we going to pay you for this therapy?
ooo annother one:
Stop making Christianity a scapegoat for not developing a personality. Quit being judgemental, flakey, egotistical, mean, rude, fake in the name of a God who was none of those things.
or how bout – if you don’t like go to another blog
Hey Tony…you got a blog or whatever? I would totally read it, or hang out there or something. Email me…let’s hang out. Yeah yeah.
Christians are boring. Christians are the reason people don’t want to become Christians
Sharon-
Wow, that was intense. Thank you for your honesty and yes, you’re right, it NEEDED to be said.
http://www.vagabondrunn.wordpress.com
lots of things…but i get ticked off when people and the media assume you HAVE to be a conservative republican to be a Christ follower. like i must be in love with Huckabee or something. most of that agenda seems to me to be the opposite of what Jesus would do.
Why do I have to pray for this crippled guy again? and again? and again?
Why won’t he just get healed already?
I can say this in my tribe but not in church.
I really like sex but intimacy is better.
these are really fantastic. you know, we all need a little help I think!
now for a serious note – yep, we are all human and we all have thoughts that really shouldn’t be spoken – we are not perfect and won’t be for awhile
thanks to all of you who have been brave enough to lay it out there – you pray for me, and I’ll pray for you
(boy, that will get some comments, I’m sure)
That I am in over my head
@*&!**% and #$!&%$ and *&%(@@
I wish I could believe God more, rather than just believe in God more.
I used to watch porn every Sunday morning- and then masturbate in service.
I love, love, love Harry Potter. No biggie for a lot of Christians I know, but it’s easier to avoid it at the risk of having one of those other Christians totally go off on you.
I like a lot of those Emergent guys and gals and I’m Southern Baptist. There I said it! Whew! Glad I got that off my chest!
i’m catching up from the last time reading this morning…
THANK YOU SHARON for… “Your 14/15/16/17/18 year old daughter looks like a SLUT in those Abercrombie shirts & jeans. They are too tight & low & her boobs are falling out and her pubic hair is peaking out from the top of her jeans. All the young teenage boys are going crazy and probably older men are lusting after your child – CHILD. Get a Frick’n clue & teach her some modesty or perhaps you yourself are so caught up in the latest fashion that you don’t care if your daughter dresses like a SLUTâ€
not that any man in church would struggle with such a thing…but yeah! that could be said pretty much every week!
i’m a pastor so I would really get in trouble for saying this. . . but sometimes I just don’t like people. not all people. just some people. and some of those people I really don’t like
That I went to go see Anne when she came to speak in Decatur, AL on porn sunday (and she did a great job). And also that I do know Jan Owen (now, let’s see if Jan can figure out who I am!). (BTW, Jan is a great worship leader.) [Alright, this isn't really what I have trouble saying, but I just wanted to remind Jan that everyone knows everything on the web!]
In general I think we are taught to put on a fake front as Christians, We are so afraid of offending people that we forget our humanity or worse we are too concerned about looking good or playing the role or, or, or…
I love what one of my pastors once said to my friend about our bible study group, he said: you need to get into each others s@%t. I don’t see these problems in the 1st century Church, in fact wasn’t this what they were getting away from?
I can’t stand most people. There are too many stupid people out there. And if you can’t read or speak the language of the country you’re in you should have a drivers license, and maybe you should have to pass an IQ test before they issue one anyway… for a few
Some Sundays I’d rather be at home reading a book, or at the beach, or sleeping than leading my church
Raising my hand:
“Umm, pastor… I have a question.”
I know several women named “Liz” but honestly don’t know exactly which one you are. I also make no secret of my beliefs, I just don’t always talk about them. I was just making a joke. So who are you?
Why is it that most models for Spiritual growth are all based on ACTIONS? Attendance, giving, small group membership, serving. These are ways that we track growth according to most models. I understand that these may be indications of growth, but they also may not be indicators at all. Kind of interesting for grace based faiths to judge growth based on works.
Don’t worry, Jan – I knew you were joking! I’m the old single “Liz” with the cats (I also kept Christie and Robert’s cats for almost six months while their house was on the market a few years back).
Now, to the topic at hand, something I can’t say in church or around other Christians: It feels kind of pathetic to be a 40 year old virgin (even if I do believe sex should be saved for marriage).
Why was I told that dancing is a sin? It looks like so much fun.
Anne- ok so maybe I am your groupie b/c when I saw your comment on my blog I sort of felt like Bon Jovi had commented on my blog or something, haha! :)
If you are a christian and you shop at stores owned by christians…don’t expect a $@$% discount, nor act like “B” either, you act worse that “non-christians”.
People…be real. Stop acting like a bunch of fake, happy, cheery, problem-less people you think you are. You are weak, hurting, depressed, struggling, and dealing with physical, mental, spiritual struggles just like me….
Accountability goes beyond just “reading and praying” -its genuine love and fellowship, it goes beyond our 2 hours on a Sunday morning. Get off the internet, hang up the phone, stop texting, turn the TV off and be with people, live your life with them.
I enjoy a beer or two. I enjoy listening to music that isn’t “christian”. I think your “abstaining” from certain things is stupid. And should not judge my relationship with the Lord.
Enough said….for now.
@Food For Thought – Amen!
I wish all Churchs and Christians period would stop making up sins, like drinking and dancing. I like wine and I love to dance.
oh wait, I do say that in church. Yea, I pretty much say what I think no matter where I am.
oh wait, I thought of something; I think some people pray in tongues to avoid having a real conversation with God.
Yikes, yea, that ones gonna get me in trouble.
“that song sucked”
“Last call for alcohol!”
your sermon really sucked this morning
First off- in reference to one of the first comments- Facing the Giants was a stupid movie… good idea… but seemed more like a comedy to me. lol
But mine would be:
I hate that when I explain my understanding of freedom in Christ, some Christians think that is my way of excusing sin. That makes me want to give them the middle finger (which I admit would probably be a sin, which proves that I am not excusing my sin)
that i’m tired of appearing “perfect little christian girl.” when i screw up big time too.
its like i’m seen as incapable of messing up..
P.S. This is a great idea Anne! actually… if a pastor would ask the congregation this question every sunday… I would go to his church!
“i don’t really care or want to help. please leave me alone.”
that, of course, is my apathetic flesh speaking. the spirit of Christ is the only compassionate thing in me … praise God :D
Idk if I’m just addicted to this… but like i said… Christian friends everywhere should ask each other the question we are responding to here, everyday! so things just keep popping into my head. but anyway my additional comment is this:
I think that praying for a meal is a very very vain thing! (and by “vain” i mean: “producing no result; useless” and so is saying “God bless you” when someone sneezes- and that one is often border line blasphemy too!
i hope you don’t figure out that i have no idea what i’m doing.
I would say…
“I can be on the quieter side sometimes, but God can use me just as much as the more outspoken ones… why can’t you see that?”
That I don’t like the word “Sucks” (sorry Anne) and I hear a lot of pastors use it.
Now I’ll go take the log out of my eye.
I loved this idea so much that I blogged about it!
i linked back here… hope that’s alright!
http://bigearcreations.blogspot.com/2008/05/what-cant-you-say-around-christians.html
All the people who just want to control me should go shove it.
I had an abortion. No, I am not proud of it but would you still accept me if you knew?
There’s a lot being said here but I feel like I have to ask: what are you going to do about it? Are you just going to comment here and leave it at that? Or are you going to take the courage to say it to someone who matters and who can make a difference in your own life and the life of your church?
@Anonymous #103 – May 6 2008
I would accept you. And you know what? Jesus already has
why did red wine gums (whatever the heck that means) have to ruin the party by saying something serious?
there you go!
I suck at praying regularly
Red wine gums – thank you – and I know that. For a long time I wasn’t sure but I have found amazing healing and restoration. It still just isn’t something I think some Christians would handle well.
you want to go grab a beer & cigar after this?
Is it just me or does this just seem like one giant club?
i wish you wouldn’t judge my on the fact that i live with my fiance. did you know that i have been pretty much on my own as far as providing for myself since i was 16? did you know that i put myself through college working a job and a half and going to school full time to work with people that you would laugh at and not to mention i get paid close to nothing? do you know that i have kept my promise to God that i made when i was 14 even if to you it may not look like i have? do you really know my heart or did you forget that you aren’t qualified to make that judgement? and there are many more, but i think someone has covered them….
I LOVE THIS! Mine is this:
I love God but struggle at times to be 100% real for him. I suck @ reading my bible, but strive to do so. I drift when I pray. I strive for his presence but struggle with the cynicism built by my own inconsistencies and the inconsistencies of those around me. i want to learn to extend grace on the level that i need grace.
A lot of this makes me sad b/c I do say what I think/feel. And I make friends like crazy. Not that I’m pumping sunshine up my own butt, but try it sometime. Just say it. You will be more respected for saying it than you will for not saying it. If you don’t say it, you’re just as fake as they are. Right?
Here’s a go — all of this can be found on my blog btw — I’m very public.
1) I am divorced and remarried
2) I have genital herpes
3) I have 2 tattoos
4) I like Mikes Hard Lemonade
5) My husband is great at sex
6) I think women who make other women feel less than a Christian are militant Christians and I don’t want to be their friend anyway.
Love to all!!!!!!
Great post, Anne!!
Most of the time I never feel forgiven for my sins…. partly because its hard to forgive my self… the other part is that church people seem to never let you let it go and move forward.
I find most Evangelism repulsive – I’m a Christian and have spent most of my adult life doing missions work.I’ve said this out loud before. I usually receive a response of shock and awe.
Hey anonymous ******
By anonymous on May 6, 2008 | Reply
I had an abortion. No, I am not proud of it but would you still accept me if you knew?
******
yes, of course I’d accept you if I knew you – duh, big duh.
Being against abortion and having the ability to see separation between the “abortion rights political circus” is really not the same as kicking the woman to the curb. The 2 are very different and I’d go so far to speculate that most of us who are “pro life” have the ability to separate the deed from the woman. The atmosphere for “fetuses” became what it is today many many many moons ago.
Is one sin worse than the other? Gheesh – some of these are funny & I have laughed out loud & others just make me sad that people are so caught up with the guilt and inability to forgive themselves. Get a counselor if you need to but get over it already.
Now – you with the genital Herpes – why do I have to know that???? that’s like having toe fungus – don’t really care. heh! Are the tattoos and herpes related? Did you get one from the other cuz I have 2 tats – but that was because of cable tv.
anyway my last out loud would be…
What kind of Christians is the Post Modern church putting out? Do we know our theology or do we know that we just look better at doing church then the Muslims do???for example.
peace.
Your church sucks. I don’t know why half of you actually still go there. The music is way too loud and my ears are still ringing on Tuesday. The youth (and half the adults) care nothing about what goes on here, save for the gossip. I’d like to tear down that life-sized painting of the pastor from the entryway, rip it to itty bitty pieces and burn the shreds in front of her and remind her that we’re not promised prosperity, money, stocks or a mansion.
Hmph. That felt good. :)
I hate it when people ask for prayer for their neighbors brother’s cousin (or some person like 5 times linked in the distance from the person you actually know). Seriously, why does that need to go in OUR church bulletin? We don’t know them! I don’t even take enough (or hardly any) time to pray for myself and MY family, let alone will i ever care to pray for your neighbors brother’s cousin!! I hate that prayer has become so competitive…who can share the saddest and most dramatic sob story…thinking if their’s is the best people will pray for it.
That is what i wish i could say in church.
Sharon: Because there are MILLIONS of people who suffer from herpes too and won’t admit it. I am here to say I too suffer and no you (another sufferer) need not be ashamed. Since you pried — the herpes did not come from the tattoos — that is a question of ignorance by the way — or maybe you were just being catty. They came from my ex-husband. Thus, the EX in husband. Get me now? Glad you pried? Prolly not!
Heidi
of
http://www.candidchatter.wordpress.com
I’ve burned the book on “how to be a good pastor’s wife”. I want to be me. I don’t want kids. I don’t want to wear a floral dress and perm my hair. I am intelligent and competent. I am a woman – don’t insult my intelligence by saying I have to be a secretary or children’s worker in order to contribute to this church.
Yeah, I too have said this. Thank God for an understanding husband…i like him…a lot.
great post. we need some more REAL women like you out there.
I know I am sining and I sometimes don’t want to change. Definently can’t say that in church.
I like your blog. Your an interesting person.
Too many churches are social clubs and not mission centers… and the “members” would scoff at you for speaking anything negative about their cool club.
Heidi:
Chill – if you had read my post you would have seen that I also have qty 2 tattoos & it was meant as a joke – in jest – i’m not ignorant of tattoos – at all. Alot of people still think tatts are gross & nasty & are “tramp stamps” I don’t think that about them.
No, I didn’t pry into your business – that’s impossible since the info is clearly in Your post. If you hadn’t wanted comments (good or bad) you wouldn’t have posted the info. The other posts were somewhat lighthearted and that’s what I was getting at. Sorry that you didn’t take it that way and are a bit more touchy then I expected. I wasn’t being “catty” i’m not that type of person. Sorry I hit a raw nerve.
I will forever and always be more cautious when I post lest I offend or pry into a matter that has been posted in the public arena. Ok – that was being catty.
Amen to Sharon! If we could teach young girls to dress their age and make them understand what men deal with … well, some of them would still do it. So perhaps if dads stepped up and loved their daughters so they knew they were beautiful and their moms stopped dressing like 18 year olds, church could actually focus on Jesus.
I want to bring extra cardigans to church to hand out so my husband and other men can focus.
And I would say … I don’t love a lot of people. In fact, there are a lot of people I don’t even like.
Well it is clear I took you wrong. My apologies, Sharon. Please forgive.
HR
That I can’t stand James Dobson, his narrow and belittling political views, and most of the Religious Right.
“What part of ‘test all things, hold fast that which is good’ did you people not understand?”
Hey, church, lets burn down this pretty building and huddle in the ashes, where we can’t be distracted by music and technology, and all the things we think our church needs. Let’s get “naked” so all that we see and know is what’s going on in the spiritual realm. Do you guys have any clue that that’s where the real action takes place?
I don’t get Dobson either, even Lucado most of the time (and never have finished “Purpose Driven whatever…). Could it be that Jesus was right when he said that a student would never be greater than his teacher? So if I want to know truth, shouldn’t I get to know the author of truth rather than 2nd or 3rd hand info?!??!
I really don’t mean to be “name calling” but if the name is used from the pulpit….
anne
what a lovely question. i’ve read all the responses thus far and i would have to say that i have, at one time or another, probably thought all of them.
my biggies are often when people are talking to me..telling me something they find important, i’m usually think “just shut up and go away…i don’t care!!”
also, whenever a particular person comes to mind all i can think is “i hate her, i hate her”. so i can’t seem to forgive her…even though i know i’m far from perfect myself.
admitting that to some ‘good christian folk’..would just land me in an intervention.
love ya anne girl!
I am going to be brutally honest here. This is what I would say in my home church, to my pastor, if I had the guts.
You are boring. You are super smart, and I can tell you love the word and you love God, but you never stay on track and you ramble, ramble, ramble! My butt goes numb every Sunday, and your voice starts to sound like the adults on Charlie Brown.
I like to watch the pink haired lady on TBN!
I don’t believe church “services” are supposed to be seeker-friendly, nor are church programs and ministries supposed to be for believers. Ironic, no? The church essentially says, “You get ‘em here, we’ll get ‘em saved.” The point of the church gathering was never to preach the gospel–that was the mission of the church as a body, but not the point of the gathering. The gathering was to build up the believers. And all this talk about ministry makes me sick when all it is is just meeting our own needs. Let’s have a scrapbook night and gym night and potlucks just for ourselves…because that’s what Jesus called us to, right? Oh…he wanted us to GO into the WORLD? Huh….
i have lots – i’m a pastor’s wife >: )
i don’t like beth moore studies
yes, my husband is amazing, just remember he’s MINE
quit being a martyr about serving in your church – it’s a biblical command, not me being bitchy
no, you don’t pay my salary & no i don’t work for you & no, it’s not my job
stop being shocked & appallled when my teenagers act like teenagers
jesus wasn’t a republican. or white. or american.
i have mor ebut i’m starting to sound bitter >: )
That your energy level is not MY energy level…and God is fine with that.. LOL. Don’t expect me to be super-saint just because you think *you* are. We’re not competing here.
The legalism in the church club is still running rampant, but God bless those who “get” what grace actually means.
Anne,
I am secretly rejoicing over a silver lining around a recent cloud that produced it. To me, it’s a radiant, thick, beautiful silver lining. So, why should I feel shamed to be thankful for the cloud, if not for the silver lining it produced? I mean, can’t we be thankful for getting killers off our streets and abortion rights activists out of government?Were the Munchkins really off-base for singing Ding-dong, the witch is dead!?
that I am a feminist- in an evangelical, non-denominational church- go girls!
“You’re so nice you’re utterly boring people.”
“There’s a difference between kindness and being nice, and nice is not a Christian virtue.”
“I don’t think your pastor has read a good book in the last ten years.”
What won’t I say? I’d say, “Our church is floundering and stuck in the mud; there’s something not right here and I can’t put my finger on it. Can we pray about our church?”
Why won’t I say it? Simply because the response would be “we don’t talk about such things here–everything’s fine, just fine, thank you”
I’ve left three church families before. One for firing their ministers for preaching from the Bible. One other since the youth minister had an affair with one of the other kids in the youth group (the courts already took care of this). How can I believe that this place is any different? It’s a megachurch, and no one knows anyone else.
To my church I would say, “you are all so complacent. you know the truth of Jesus Christ…JESUS CHRIST…and yet you don’t want to reach out to the hurting or invite/accept non-Christians because it might disturb the chemistry of your HOME group or who you go to Pizza Hut with after service. snap out of your 5th grade mentality and be proactive.”
Oh, and, “stop nodding because all the Greek translations are confusing you just as much as they are me.”
I would say that I think that most people who are in the church and claim to be Christian are indeed not truly saved in the first place…but then again who am I to judge?
Who cares if the pastor is addicted to porn or people are sleeping around in the church, or abortions are taking place or gossip and backstabbing are the norm.
I do! And I get sick of it, and we wonder why in the world the Lord does not bless His Church – give me a break! Repent!
Oh, and about the whiney slutty woman who likes to play the victim card constantly and acts all wounded when you call her on her cougar ways. I’d like to smack the woman to one end of the pew to the next and say, leave my spouse alone!
Also, why dont’ you stop judging me because I actually read and obey the bible. Take you issues up with God not me – homosexuality is wrong, and I dont’ care if you believe it or not.
Why do most Youth Pastors feel that they need to tell all of their kids that they need to be Pastors?
Why do most churches feel that their college students need to go to a Christian college?
Why are so many Christian families doing wrong by their kids and homeschooling them?
Why do Christian homeschooling families think that they have the best way to raise their kids, and feel that they need to shun those who choose to live out the commandment of “going into the world”?
Why do mainstream, middle-class, predominantly white churches shun those who are different form them? so what if some one has a tattoo or several? so what if some one has a piercing or two? According to the Bible… Jesus loves them too… and are we not called to love our neighbors?
hmm,
I would say that I think I want to homeschool my kids…not to keep them out of public schools so much as to take them into the world. Show them how to love and breathe and fill needs and take in all that is around us. :)
Just a thought.
i’ve pretty much given up on Jesus–especially and particularly in most of the ways he has been presented to me.
my spirituality is in no way dead, however, in many ways it is more alive and luscious than ever.
men:
stop acting like you have no problems and that you’re john wayne or something.
be willing to be honest about yourself with the other men in your church: either they will extend the love of Christ that is in them, or they won’t have Christ’s love to extend to you, which means you have one less maybe now many fewer (fake chrstian) men to fellowship with — and that’s a GOOD thing.
women:
hold your men accountable to get right with God if they’re not. support your men and respect them even if you feel there’s nothing about your man to respect – isn’t it possible that God sees something in your man to respect?
I like this country club. The membership dues are cheaper than the ones with the golf courses.
Is there anyone else here that is getting absolutely nothing out of it.
Does anyone here really believe this stuff means anything to God?
I question infant baptism
We should trust God to provide for us and make immigration easier for people.
Veterans Day and Fourth of July and etc. have no place in the worship of the Church.
We are not a social club.
If we are so concerned about abortion, why aren’t we lining up to adopt the many children who need good Christian parents and actually show that adoption is a good choice for a woman to make. Don’t we believe God will provide
Be a contributer not a complainer
In response to serving the hispanic community, “Its a good thing that Jesus didn’t decide to stop giving himself up for us on the cross.”
the parking lot is full of too big vehicles. women have no business ‘preaching’ (anyone read the bible anymore?) men have no business being best friends with women besides their wives. andy stanley is endlessly repetitive. messages are getting more and more manipulative and less bible based. please ladies, 1 pump of perfume only. people over 65, stop putting tons of onions in carry-in dishes. other than all that, church rocks.
I hate it when people babble in church. They call it speaking in tongues. It’s bull.
Food For Thought – Amen on your comment “Kind of interesting for grace based faiths to judge growth based on works.”
Oh boy….
1. It’s okay to stop and retune your guitar if necessary while leading worship. Really. Just turn off the amp and do it. We’ll keep praying and praising in the interim. And lots of us will be very grateful.
2. Screaming HALLELUJAH THANK YOU JESUS WE LOVE YOU LORD WE SING PRAISES TO YOUR NAME HALLELUJAH COME ON PRAISE HIM PEOPLE!…into the microphone….does not equal leading worship. It equals causing pain. Shut up for thirty seconds and trust that your audience already knows how to tell God they love Him.
3. To the “drummer”: Playing loud does not equal playing well. Being able to bang out a rhythm with sticks does not mean you are a drummer. A concert hall sized drum set, used in a room that legally seats 300, does not require amplification to be heard when there are thirty people in the audience.
4. If you are teaching a new song, sing the melody and sing it clearly. Do not embellish.
5. If you hear some bit of news about someone and proclaim, “I had a dream about that very thing!” Then the dream should actually pertain to the news. It should not be some kind of symbolic thing that you conveniently bend to mean what you want it to mean, and it is not a prophecy. It is, at best, a confirmation and perhaps an encouragement for someone.
6. Looking up Greek words in Strong’s dictionary, picking out one possible meaning/translation of a word, and then going off on your own preconceived tangent is NOT the same as knowing Greek. Do not expect me to pretend it is when I know better, and do not expect me to holler AMEN to your cr… teaching when I know that is not what the Greek says.
7. Just because I am female does not automatically mean I am good with small children.
8. I am opposed to abortion in almost every instance. I still want it to be legal. I don’t want women who don’t share my point of view to not have access to a medically safe procedure.
9. You do not have to be a Republican to be born again.
Okay, that’s enough for now.
Please let me use my gifts instead of trying to smash this square peg into a round hole. And when I don’t fit into your round hole, don’t toss me aside like a rag. Just because I’m shy and not good with kids doesn’t mean I’m without gifts to use for the Kingdom.
Note to church leaders: don’t assume that you are easily reached or approachable. And when someone does come to you with a concern, really listen and then follow up with them.
Technology is wonderful, when it works. Always be ready for glitches though. Worshiping a capella without amplification can be even more moving than having all the bells and whistles. If someone on your worship team can’t sing without accompaniment, then they really can’t sing very well at all.
If we are to trust God for our needs, Why not the “Church” do the same? Put a box in the back and stop passing the plate! God will provide and bless what He has ordained.
Thanks Anne for the question.
Elizabeth N, amen about the abortion thing. I know girls who couldn’t get access to an abortion so tried to do it themselves which could be very harmful. While it would be better if they weren’t having one in any form if its gonna happen i’d much rather it happen safely.
I don’t believe in Eternal Conscious Torment, and want to believe in Universal Salvation (though there are some people I wouldn’t mind seeing in a prolonged, tho not eternal, Hell).
I believe in Evangelical Inclusivism. Jesus saves everybody, but people still should hear the Gospel. And regrettably, some people may make themselves irreconcilable to God.
That said, I don’t love everybody, don’t want to love everybody, and think that (premature) forgiveness is widely overhyped.
Civil union for gays. I’m not too irate on gay civil marriage. But once the State starts violating religious rights to enforce gay rights, the war is on!
Christian youth group should include rigorous apologetics, radical compassion, martial arts & small weapons training.
I really want to ask your daughter out, but I won’t even consider it till she graduates high school. Even then, I won’t really do it.
Stop feeling so much and start thinking, darn it!
I believe in speaking in tongues, BUT we Charies/Penties probably are not speaking in Divine-given real languages. We are probably just spilling our spiritual guts in a Holy-Spirit-given gibberish.
IF there is a future Tribulation, the Rapture will happen way late into it (at the 7th Trumpet, before the Seven Vials- Revelation 11 & 14). However, it may well be that most End-Time prophecies were fulfilled in 70 A.D.
Accountability group? Everyone from the church that I would tell any real secrets to are either in my family, and very good sworn-to-secrecy friends, the best one of which left the church because she’s gay. Like I’d tell anything really substantial to 95% of my fellow church folk!
I have no problem with national flags & secular holidays acknowledged in Church.
But saying the Pledge occasionally while never saying the Creed or any liturgy, and basing services around Mothers Day while not even mentioning Pentecost (IN A PENTECOSTAL CHURCH- the AofG) is just stupid.
To Eric Brown, I’m not a socialist and I hate the worship industry too.
Also, wine, beer or something harder?
1. I don’t like Christian music AT ALL.
2. I hate when people pray out loud and ramble on and on and on.
3. Gay marriage and abortion are not the most imortant issues.
In God’s Grace John.
Ma’am, I really wish you would have put some more clothes on this morning.
This is my new favorite blog
Oh, and I forgot to mention. Having the Gideons come to talk is usually a torture for me.
John, what a bummer that your church’s Gideons talks are torture for you. We’ve had the same couple of guys in for years now and they give great talks. Very inspiring and interesting. That’s one of the annual events to which I always look forward.
That both George Bushes and John Kerry are part of a secret society called the Order of Death (or Skull & Bones), whose initiation rites involve masturbating in coffins and other morbid unspeakables.
Please keep in mind this is for things you feel like you can’t say in church…because you feel like you might be judged
…not because you have a chip on your shoulder and like to whine and moan and judge others. :)
Carry on.
1. Why are there so few interracial couples in churches?
2. Why can’t there be an open space for dancing during the praise & worship time? Why can’t we try something new like folk-dancing to make it more interactive? Like a celebration.
Ok, the real reason I homeskrool my kid – I don’t like to get up in the morning.
Jusr becuase I’m single and female doesn’t mean I want your husband / boyfriend.
Oh Anne, I would say all those things in my church in a heartbeat if I wasn’t quite certain I’d get thrown out on my ear. I get what you’re saying, though.
I want to tell some Dads to love their daughters and take a stand and tell them to put on some more clothes… their wifes too!
I want to tell single Christian men that they need to remember that that beauty is fleeting!
I want to tell parents that it is OK to tell your kids NO! And that for the good of society, they need to tell them NO!
I want to tell many churches the reality of why they need to pay attention to families and children and youth and college students and singles.
I am quite confident that if i were to have said those things to people in the church that was my former employer… my employment would not have lasted as long as it did!
Sometimes the truth really sucks!
Wow. A friend of mine pointed me here. I have read this as a foreigner, and what I hear is that most of you want reality not fakery and yet are too afraid to say that in church.
Wow.
Goodness me, if this was how people felt in my church I would be on my knees weeping before God and begging for mercy. Is this truly a reflection of how Christians feel in your country?
I guess it happens everywhere. I pray with all my heart that no-one in my small flock is ever too scared to say anything. Yet I know they probably are – people are people. Better get back on my knees.
The Catholic decadence was,and now comes the prosperity.The prosperity of protestants was and now comes the decline,dont you see it??Im a former protestant but now i do not want me beeing called protestant is a shame,you live inmersed in femenist ideas,evolucionist views,and concepts that every thing is about how society raise you,as the comunist in the 70s thought.You are not Christians,because you dont read the Bible as it speaks.You try to understand the Bible under human ideas supervision instead of understand human ideas under Gods view.You are lost,MY words are words that God put in my lips,there are not my owne ideas.Im a modern prophet but who is going to hear me,nobody.Because everybody is going to judge me under his sinful eyes.God is great,Who can understand His infinite love??if you write me.
I don’t have any desire to make non-christians christian. I think a lot of them are better off staying as they are.
I do tell people I am not very good at being Christian. But I’m trying.
It REALLY drives me nuts when there are typos in the bulletin or on the worship slides.
I don’t love God (nor most people). I get frustrated reading the Bible. If God wanted to us to have a relationship with him, he should have made the stories and information in the Bible easy to understand for everyone – not just scholars & others who spend hours studying.
The sermons here are pretty bad. It would be nice if the pastor would just preach the text and stop reading in all kinds of psychological babble and speculations about why so and so did whatever he did. Maybe I would actually learn something about the Bible if he did that.
Got a new boat did you? Did you help anyone financially? Going camping again this weekend? Are you taking God with you? Going away again? Did you leave your tithe or will you make it up?
So…can you tell I am a pastor (who sometimes gets frustrated at poor excuses for being gone?) :)
I’d like to say to some people in my church (if they’d listen):
Why do you think homeschooling = sheltered kids? Can’t you see that my kids are living a terrific life? We’re meeting all kinds of people, watching & discussing movies, eating junk food, reading sci-fi/fantasy, using non-Christian curriculum, painting LOTR minatures, having drama lessons, exploring our city, and learning about the world. Oh, and we read the Bible and pray too.
i HATE that the church is known for hating gay people (whether that’s true or not)
i think most churches spend too much money and put too much effort and time into ‘producing’ church services
i don’t really ‘get’ Jesus…i can grasp the concept of Father God, but the convergence of the God/man is something/someone i find very hard to relate to, and while i’ve been a Christian for 30 years and i love Jesus and am grateful to him for my salvation, i don’t really have a ‘relationship’ with him…and that makes me weep
also, my Christian husband and i almost never speak of spiritual things…we have almost no spiritual connection at all
1 God does not have a short attention span and you don’t have to say his name every other word when you are praying.
2 God is probably doing interesting things in your life and you don’t have to borrow someone else’s story and put it in a sermon as if it happened to you.
3. I do not think Calvininsm is a prerequisite for Christianity. I am an Armenian. Deal with it.
I self harm, and I’m not sure I want to stop.
I don’t know if I love God.
I think that all humans are capable of being attracted to and loving another human……. regardless of gender. You can choose not to, you can even repulsed by the thought, but I just think it is part of being human, even if it’s not part of being a disciple.
That I dress up at church out of respect for God, not some tradition. And I kinda judge you if you haven’t attempted to take some pride in your appearance at church. ‘Cause we all know you got to sleep at least two hours later.
That most women in their 20’s dress like hooches in church to impress some guy in another row. And that it makes me want to punch some of my good female friends in the face.
That is pastor’s keep pretending like the internet is not the place to be relevant and reach people, (including youth pastors/leaders getting more involved on social networks), then we’re never going to catch up with people.
Anne, this is awesome. Thanks for asking.
I have a couple of people that i can be candid with but here’s a couple of things:
I hate being 26 and single. I believe that God will bring the right guy along, but I wish He’d hurry up!
Thankyou for telling me how much you love singing, but don’t say that and then pass me over for a major event for someone younger, skinnier, etc! (I was going to add another qualifier, but i’ve been in trouble for blog contents before!)
My last one – Christians make for HORRIBLE customers! Stop asking for discount!
Clarification: that should say ’singing with me’
that the denomination/church i belong to is known for teaching the word, not for loving well.
that I yell at my kids a lot; that I’m not the sweet calm person they think I am.
On the way home from a church women’s retreat, my wife and sister were riding with a couple of other girls. The driver decided to go THREE hours in the wrong direction to have lunch at Cracker Barrel — without asking anyone else in the car…
By the time 2:00 rolled around and everyone realized what was happening (because they were about to enter another state), the conversation, I’m told went like this:
My Wife: “I need to get out of this car.”
My sister: “I need a cigarette.”
Another Passenger: “I need a beer.”
The driver: “Don’t say that in front of you know who…”
Another Passenger: “Why? You know you want one too…”
This should be required reading for ALL pastors
If your calling is evangelism leave the pulpit to those who are chosen to preach, don’t use the church to support your around the globe ventures, if you are truly called God will provide
Fact; barely clothed young girls stir lustful thoughts in 99.9% of men, put some clothes on!
Fact; 2 ounces of perfume will make others physically sick, use a mist
Fact; I now have hearing loss from the over amplified worship music, lose the amps
As a (dry) alcoholic, I wish the Bible condemned drinking, but it doesn’t. Does say a lot about gossip, though.
http://www.midlandjack.blogspot.com
I think all Christians should feel free to have a pickin’ glass of wine or beer when they feel like it. I shouldn’t feel embarrassed when someone from church sees me out at dinner having a glass of Cab with my dinner.
I am depressed. Really, really depressed. I’m a Christian. A 100% born again Christian. Why do so many people think that the two can’t go hand in hand?
I wish the people nect to me in church would want to talk, not just say hello. I do try..
Tater,
Check out http://www.morethancoping.wordpress.com
there are some amazing people there.
To the people who dont find a point in praying before meals. Try fasting for a day or two, and then see how thankful you are for that first meal. Thats what changed my mind on the subject.
When an ostrich sticks his head in the sand the largest & least appealing part of his body sticks out.
Humans don’t have feather camouflage.
Why can’t we have dialog instead of sticking our heads in the sand hoping problems will go away.
I never pray out loud in front of other people (I hardly ever pray out loud, but when I do it’s usually in the shower or car alone) – not even before meals. I hate it and feel totally incapable of it for some reason.
Childish. Self involved. Most of you would do your churches a favor by leaving. For the one who said that other people would be better off no being Christians – you are not one.
I think most of what I was taught to believe is a bunch of BS.
Yet, I feel closer to God, and more at peace with who I am in Christ than I ever did growing up.
I am an industrial-strength introvert and get extremely exhausted if I spend too much time with people…and ‘too much’ looks like ‘very little’ to most people. Even wonderful people who God’s put in my life and whom I adore. And I feel EXTREMELY guilty about that. Especially when the emphasis at church seems to be “love God = hang out with people every moment you’re not sleeping.”
I am starving for grace.
I have no idea if I ever want to get married. But I’d like at least one guy to think I’m beautiful. And I’m worried that I’m increasingly freakish, especially within the Christian community, to be a single woman.
I want to scream every time my local Christian radio station proudly proclaims its mission as being ‘family-friendly.’ As if Jesus came to take the kids out to the picnic and abolish swearing.
I think liturgy can be beautiful and I wish we celebrated the Lord’s Supper much more often.
Thank you for this forum for an ocean of honesty, Anne!!!!
I hear you on the introverted thing. :)
“I am rather inclined to silence, and whether that be wise or not, it is at least more unusual nowadays to find a man who can hold his tongue than to find one who cannot.”
-Abraham Lincoln
I would ask: How can you act that way? Are you people even reading the same Bible I am?
Can’t stop.
Too many obligations.
Too much wasted time already.
I’ve got to matter.
Try to relax and the phone rings.
Succumb to it, or bite their head off…
“Supposed” to be spiritual.
“Ought” to be.
“Should” be.
Three worst words ever.
Counseling’s not helping.
Still angry all the time.
No answers.
Not even from heaven.
Not even when I ask Him.
Don’t admit to it.
Never the right format.
Never the right people.
Think of your position.
Think of your witness.
Think of your image.
(not necessarily in that order)
No one will ever marry an angry man.
Admit to any of it and guarantee a lonely end.
Too old now anyway.
Wish I was Carlos (and I do).
Always my fault.
I’m a guy, I’m responsible.
Shackle myself.
Lock myself away.
Keep everyone else safer…right?
Physically ill.
Wait for doctor appointment.
Mentally ill.
Wait for the therapist to be back from vacation.
Falling apart.
“Ever-present help” goes silent.
No freedom to get help.
No freedom to confess.
No freedom to make a mistake.
Ever.
And so I post cryptic, seldom poetic nonsense like this on one of my idolized blog gods’ pages.
Because I can’t let my church know their worship leader is crumbling.
That would “taint the message”.
Church-y answers?
Aren’t.
how can anyone truly believe in “limited atonement”? i.e. calvinism? where does that leave our friends, our family, our doctors, our teachers, the next door neighbor who picks up cold medicine for you because your husband is out of town, the muslim child who brings you flowers. i can’t believe it and can’t stomach a god who would create such a plan, but am afraid i will go to hell if i don’t.
You keep your eyes on Israel – - – I’ll keep trying to keep my eyes on Jesus
´Yeah I think she is pretty cute´
And I get mostly negative reactions from guys, girls are more understanding when it comes to talking about looks. A lot of my close friends that are girls look cute at times, and I just tell them that. Then like 2 or 3 of the 20 guy friends that I have question my motives. What? Your hair looks good that way!
I still feel like it is impossible to have a mature discussion about struggles with sexual morality with some guys. Also I cringe at the name ´accountability partners´Something that has continously failed in my life.
I can´t think of much more. I was looking at the athetist website that had some thing similar. Friendly Athetist.com, comments were….less the friendly. Half of them just wanted to complain rather then discuss it. Oh well….
powerful stuff D
Whoops, that was meant to be Joe
powerful stuff D.
I feel suffocatingly alone, almost all the time. I am politically apathetic, and can’t stand almost any true republican I meet. I am a pacifist. I don’t like Christian music. I don’t want to convert anyone. My greatest fear is dying. I love saying the word shit. I think women are absolutely equal to men. I don’t see anything resembling our modern church in the New Testament. I don’t think tithing (even though it pays our salaries) is a New Testament principle. I kinda think televangelists could be some sort of sub-human race. I think you can be Christian and gay. I am becoming increasingly irritated at God for how invisible He is. Sometimes the only thing that soothes this ache is a night drinking with friends. I wish we could quit the ministry and never look back, because maybe there is a church out there that I could love and that could love me and maybe we could figure this life thing out there.
that i don’t think that “non-christians” should be held to the same set of rules for life as people who have chosen to live their life by god’s rules. it helps with the judging and the ideas of abortion and gay marriage. why should they have to live by my rules, if they never agreed to the terms of those rules.
It would be good for pastors to read these comments. Might get some good ideas for sermons.
I agree with some who mentioned we don’t need to judge those outside the church. About abortion, homosexuality, etc. They need to get saved by Jesus, from lives of futility leading to death. Then the Holy Spirit will convict of sin.
I probably wouldn’t mention that I don’t believe, or at least am not sure, that people burn in hell forever. There are too many references to death versus life, and total destruction of the wicked.
Confronting truth is always a hard one and trying to point to point out things that aren’t going so well. We kind of need a [cleaner-mouthed] Gordon Ramsey in our holy kitchens to tell us the soup is off.
Rich
http://www.offereverything.blogspot.com/
Confronting truth is always a hard one and trying to point out things that aren’t going so well. We kind of need a [cleaner-mouthed] Gordon Ramsey in our holy kitchens to tell us the soup is off.
Rich
http://www.offereverything.blogspot.com/
Am I the only one who wants revival?
I always looks to see what everyone else is wearing at church and then feel happy when I am dressed prettier than my friends.
I wish that some women would know that it isn’t a sin to wear makeup. You would actually look at lot prettier. I know that God created you just the way you are, but I would be able to actually smile (and not just fake smile) at you if you were wearing just a little mascara.
I am 17, a women and called to the ministry. It isn’t children’s ministry. When I do preach, I refuse to wear blazers and instead wear really girly things. Just because women who preach are doing a job that normally men do, does not mean that they have to look like a man (or Hilary Clinton).
I want to understand the Bible and take notes in church. I go crazy when I am sitting next to someone who clearly isn’t paying attention and is instead just giggly ’cause she is holding hands with her boyfriend. Focus, you are in church!
There is more, but this was helpful. Thank you.
Hey Anne (and Chris of course)
Selfish side:
I hate this.
I would rather be sleeping.
This music sucks so bad.
Give me a book/bible, a park bench (soul soak plug),some time and a notebook over a pastor any day.
I wish the guy behind me would freaking breath out of his mouth and not his nose, so his nose hair quartet would end that most annoying song in the world.
I wish the guy beside me would breath out his nose cause he is fogging up the stained glass (RIP-Such a beautiful art that we do not see now and days).
I wish the lady in front would just stop breathing in general. Its like a movie theater!
Did you just say that?
Thats not even funny. That was actually kinda gross (When pastors dive into sexual humor and bring up “Stories”)
Concerned side:
Pretty sure I read this same message on pastors.com
Moola accounts? Where is our money going. No, not just on the big “We’re building a bigger gym/sanctuary/parking lot/playground….Sancgymarkinglayground.”
Did you seriously just make up a cheese ball name for this room, which happens to have two basketball rims at either side, in which I worship in?
I did not know U2 was playing her this morning. Oh look….yes…theres The Edge.
Oh look…Clicks are forming not only in the youth but in college ministries and in adult.
Does anyone actually want to be here?
Didn’t I see you at Tanners?
How many people where dragged here?
Oh wow…awww weeee….whoa…Lasers are awesome…*cough*..”when Jesus realized that the Pharisees had…..”
….And finally….
the number one question of the year…that you would never hear at church, that I would love to boldly ask….
Who’s hungover….woooweee….*slaps knee*
That I am struggling with the lack of depth in the preaching/teaching ministry there and we are thinking of leaving to look for another church.
“I just farted”
Mentioning that Pete’s fly is down
“Your so fake, why are you even here. You should just bounce on outta here. No really. Bounce .”
- sssshhhhhh. i’m hung over.
- your kid is REALLY starting to piss me off.
- i’m an addict.
Great seeing you at the strip club last night.
What year was that wine.
I got a tatto yesterday. Sorry, can’t show you where it is right now.
Is it just me or are the women on the worship team wearing really short skirts?
That I think the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan are unjustified.
That when I’m at church I don’t want to talk about work – in other words, please call me on Monday and I’ll help you with your computer.
That I think Christianity has become a consumer industry, so no, I don’t like your latest t-shirt/book/keychain/bookmark.
“You have totally drunk the Obama Kool-Aid.”
Seriously, I can’t say I’m a Conservative anymore, because I’m afraid people assume I didn’t think about the issues. Well I got news for you – I did think through the issues, and I’m still a conservative. And YES, I do care about the poor, I just see lots of evidence that funneling money through the government is not the right way to care for the poor!
@#*%!
“I disagree”
That I feel totally lost in this world.
I am afraid of church people.
I think half men I know in the church are weak, lustful, excuse making little men with no self control who secretly look at porn and who will eventually cheat on their wives and blame everyone else when they get caught all the while judging others in order to feel significant.
I think most women I know in the church are secretly terrified that they are married to one of the above.
and I think most people are full of complete and utter bulls**t
@NameDeleted
“your kid is REALLY starting to piss me off.”
LOL!!!
peace|dewde
- that the church is missing the point of all the red letters in the bible
I feel like if I brought that up – I would get theologically beat down. I have no schooling – no seminary – no “touched by an angel” moment. But I do feel like the church as a whole is missing the point of those red letters…
And I feel if I were to say that I would get jumped by the pastor, assistant pastor, worship leader, youth pastor and women’s bible study group as i headed to my car after another sunday of weak sermons…
just my $.02
that a certain staff member is a real @$$%*!# – if that person were in Customer Service instead of Christian Service, they’d be fired!
or that I’m a real @$$%*!# and have come to realize it and need help with that instead of patronizing smiles
I think you’re more superficial than people “out in the world.” At least they accept me as I am.
I just want you to accept me. How come I have to go the outcasts of the church to find true Godly acceptance? Just because I can’t afford super nice clothes, choose not to wear make up and in general just look a little different doesn’t mean I’m not a good person. I love the Lord and enjoy my quirkiness.
Just because I’m part of this ministry doesn’t mean I support every little thing they stand for.
I’m afraid to cry in front of you.
Don’t try to fix things by saying God loves me. Show me how God loves me – show me the scriptures and show them to me by living them out.
I’ve been so rejected by the church as a teenager because of my “issues” that I want to open a house for girls who have been rejected from the church because of their’s.
I can’t say that I struggle with a porn addiction because I would be blasted..even though there are safeguards, accountability and therapy at the moment. that wouldn’t matter. it wouldn’t matter that i haven’t viewed in forever. i would be jumped by many people in leadership. (not all, but most.)
I feel like we care more about what WE like or what WE have always done than what matters to those we’re “trying” to reach.
I hate the worship – I feel like it’s not relevant or purposeful or excellent – and I believe that excellence honors God.
and I think “committees” are stupid.
and I wish I were somewhere else.
Note first: Thank you all, and esp. Anne, for this.
I am bi, always have been, it is not some “phase.” I dont always like the struggle, too often I like giving in. I am bemused and excited when my husband points out a scanty clad woman with THAT look in his eyes… And ashamed when that woman is in church that way.
I would prefer to spend time talking and being REAL with the incarcerated, the sick, the senile, than pasting on a smile. And I really enjoy too much answering the fake “how are you?” with a tough honesty. I am swiss cheese, and I hate swiss cheese, but the idiom works.
There are too many things I hesitate to say, and some I dont hesitate enough to say.
Much of it is moot anyway, cause I am in serious rebellion and havent Fellowshipped in several months. I know He’s there waiting, and I cant seem to care right now.
Yeah. That felt good. Now to go outside for a smoke. Another part of the rebellion… shh.. dont tell… *shakes her head*
One thing that always made me wonder why they do it, is when some of the ladies in our church have to sit near the front rows and have very skimpy outfits on. This is a major distraction to me (as a guy) when I am on stage trying to Worship the Lord with music. ***Ladies, take note. You can still look good, but please try to respect the people on the stage, and be a little more conservative in your choice of clothing, especially if you want to sit down front. I know I am going to get slack for this post, but I felt it needed to be said.
I wish I could tell church leadership that we can give to the community, without strings attached, and still be effective for God’s Kingdom. We can give freely in love. Seriously. We can. We should. We should love people authentically!
We don’t always have to target people who we know that we will gain attendance from.
Our church wanted to start a Downtown Outreach, but ONLY reach the professionals who make over $250,000 a year… when asked about the homeless or the less fortunate, the senior pastor said that we would have to explain to them that this is NOT for them. “We can’t park shopping carts in front of our gatherings…”
Whoa, what, wait? When can we tell people that church isn’t for their demographic?
My confession: I am absolutely in love, like seriously in LOVE with God’s word and I love praying. But… I just can’t be passionate about things that only serve the special interest of the big tithers and the squeaky wheels.
I am starting to think I am crazy…
YOU ARE NOT GOING TO ATTRACT THE 100,000 YOUNG SOLDIERS TO THIS CHURCH WITH MUSIC FROM THE 1930’s
some people might be born gay
starbucks sucks and is really just idol worship
Wow, what a topic! I’ve just laughed and cried in the past 10 minutes while reading these comments. I would have to say:
1) I’m a pastor and I struggle with lust!
2) I sometimes think we as Christians have it all wrong.
3) Those flippin’ Left Behind books and movies SUCK!
4) Kirk Cameron gets on my nerves!
5) Outreaches List of Top 100 churches is a stupid idea!
I’ve read through all of these statements above and my heart is breaking because I have to ask everyone:
Why not just say these things? Just be sure to say them gently and with love.
There is not one thing I’m afraid to say in my church, that is on my mind to saym because I trust that anything I ask in love will be answered with the same.
Why not give your fellow church-goers the benefit of the doubt and allow them to think on the things you say. Allow them the chance to show the grace God gave them to others, if they are badly offended. Start a dialog. We’re all human.
And if God puts something on your heart to say, don’t just say it. Shout it. That’s what Jesus did.
I like the concept of church but not the reality of church.
I sometimes feel like I talk at God and not to God when I pray. Quiet time seems to be the HARDEST thing for me!
1. How can you worship God fully and not know the basics of the Trinity?
2. How can you worship Christ fully and not know the basics of the atonement, justification, etc.*
3. Why do so many of us play games with God every Sunday?
4. Can some of us learn to greet newcomers without seeming fake?
5. Is that song really about God?
*I don’t mean memorizing theology words, I mean describing the Biblical teaching in your own words.
well….here’s one…. I relate making laws based on Christianity is like forcing people to become Christians…..which to me is not very Biblical. Isn’t becoming a Christian about “freedom of choice”?
@Cindy K. – I have tried to talk to people in my church/ministry about many of my concerns. They have gone unaddressed. Its really sad to tell the truth.
And I’m no the only one who feels this way on some of the topics.
I hated the movie fireproof.
I don’t care that it was made my Christians to spread the gospel. The bad acting and lame dialog makes Christians look cheesy and fake.
Thanks. That felt good.
“The preacher might be wrong.” Gasp.
Things I’d like to say:
1) I’ve not had a successful quiet time in 15 years.
2.) Prayer is often a struggle for me.
3.) I don’t like being a Southern Baptist but I love this church.
4.) I love having a beer or glass of wine.
5.) I enjoy a good cigar once or twice a month.
6.) I experience periods of depression.
6.) I want to be friends with you. love you. care about you. struggle alongside you. not just make you laugh.
7.) I think I am unfit to be leading the group I lead.
The saddest part though. I won’t say a single thing come Sunday. I’ll sing the songs with a heart of praise but then sit down and try my best to hide by being boistrous, funny Aaron.
God help me.
that the church that i’ve gotten the most help from is xxxchurch(.com)…
I learned many years ago that my struggles must be brought into the light for true healing. God called me to share my testimony of addiction and then after returning to His church of loneliness because I felt like everyone else had it all together and I was a total loser. It is funny looking back that I was never lonely when I was partying all the time, it was when I left that lifestyle that loneliness became an issue. There is so much power in authenticity, and not living in fear of what others will think about me. Once I found my worth in what God thought of me and not from what others thought of me my life became so much more full of joy and peace. Praising God for His faithfulness.
Everyone who thinks they’re cutting edge in the realm of Christiandom aren’t the people that are cutting edge.
Why do Calvary men seem to be afraid of women that aren’t their wives. Is it because I have an opinion? Or is it because you think I’m inferior?
Even though you think you’re doing a decent job, you’re really just afraid to be excellent. That’s why you blame your lack of doing something better on the fact that it’s too business like or too worldly.
Step it up CHURCH! The World is kicking out butts in the music arena because they require more of themselves than we ever would.
I hate the word transparent, it’s like the word ministry, overused and abused. Just tell me the truth….if you have to explain your case it means your actions weren’t loud enough.
There are lots of posers in the ministry. People, you better make sure it’s your calling….not just a “cool” job to have.
More churches should be run like a business. We would be a lot more “profitable” ….not just monetarily.
Churches/Pastors hang onto their staff even though they don’t make the grade because we’re all brothers and sisters in Christ, not because they are actually doing what is needed for that ministry.
Worship leaders are treated like rock stars whether or not they actually edify the church. If they look good and sound good, who cares what they do in their spare time?
sometimes i get so numb to everything that i cut myself to make sure i am still capable of feeling. and other times i am overwhelmed by emotions that i drink until i pass out so that i dont have to feel a thing.
Give that kid a valium!!!
My church is very loving and receptive to criticism. But to “the church” I would say:
I think 95% of Christians are lame and fake, and I have a harder time loving them than I do the lost.
Rich churches have to walk an extremely fine line, and most don’t even know where that is.
http://weatherford.wordpress.com
I actually say this in church at least five times a week..”man, I’m so glad I’m not you”
Many church missions programs are outdated and have to get out of the 19th and 20th century methodology. Some churches continue to use strategies and ideas that are incredibly insensitive to other cultures and make “western Christianity” appear arrogant and superior-thinking.
Faith that is “a mile wide and an inch deep” is no better than no faith at all.
Sometimes I just feel like I am going through the motions.
Sometimes I think no one here gets it.
When people shout I am embarrassed that someone in the audience who doesn’t know Jesus might think that we’re crazy.
What are we doing here? Does anyone spend time caring about people who don’t go to church?
And lastly, charity (mostly) sucks. Jesus followers are supposed to be givers of JUSTICE. Let’s do it.
I’m voting for Obama.
I’m pro-life all the way (which means I’m also in favor of protecting the lives already outside the womb and at any age), but I don’t believe McCain can (because of legal precedent) or will do anything to lessen the number of abortions.
Part of the reason I don’t feel like I can say anything is because to fully explain why I’m voting for him would take a good, long conversation and you don’t get the chance to have those conversations at church very often.
It’s also virtually impossible to explain my reasons on a blog comment, so I won’t bore you all with the many reasons why I’m voting for him.
if you’re a church leader, why are you a jerk?
jeremy camp blows.
I am voting for Obama, your clothes are too small, you want to move to a Republican state, but it’s ok for you to BE a Bratz doll, last but not least….how’s the affair going?
Wow…this is a good post! What I would say, if I had the bal…er, uhm…spine:
“For a group of people who talk so much about being a loving congregation, you sure are judgmental and disregarding of one another behind each others’ backs.”
“Go ahead and keep the ‘new people’ at a distance. But don’t be surprised when they leave, and this church dies with you.”
“Just because you’ve always done it that way, doesn’t mean it still works.”
“Quit being patronizing! We need to tell the truth to each other in love! It isn’t loving to play nice, when nice is a lie!”
“Sometimes, I just want to say ‘I quit’ and leave this church, and go somewhere else where I don’t lead or participate in 95% of the goings on.”
“Sometimes, I just flat hate to be around some of you.”
Maybe one of these days, I’ll get indignant enough to bring these thoughts from the depths of my heart into the open…consequences be darned.
“Grow the hell up and quit whining like a baby”
“If you are going to threaten to leave the church every time something doesn’t go your way, then just do it already.”
I’m thinking of the “no fly zones” in church — things we’re not supposed to meddle with in each other’s lives. Cause it’s none of our business, aparently.
1. Parenting. Don’t tell me how to parent. That’s the king of all presumptuous insults.
2. Marriage. Don’t give me marital advice or ask me why I treated my wife so badly at the restaurant. None of your business, quite frankly.
3. Business. As in, my job or my company. Don’t tell me how to run it or why I need to be more ethical or try to hold me accountable for that. You can’t possibly understand the issues I’m facing.
Ironically, these are the three major issues Paul nails on the head in his epistles. Like, over and over again. And on several occasions, Paul even goes so far as to say, “Ok, if you panzies won’t name the elephant in the room, I will.”
And we wonder why we’re not becoming more like Jesus… it’s at least partly because the three major areas of discipleship are no fly zones between us.
# 1 Ms Applesauce you say:
That sometimes when we are at churches trying to raise support, I totally go comando.
You mean Comando as in NO UNDIES comando? My husband always calls going w/out underwear GOING COMANDO…. is that what you are saying?
If so…then….THAT’S FREAK’N…ok… :-)
i forgot to pack my underwear last month on a trip – 3 days – it was rough.
and # 242
The Church Bartender said,
October 17, 2008 at 11:05 am
starbucks sucks and is really just idol worship
I’m starting to believe that you are right! How much $ could we give if we wouldn’t spend it on S’bucks. I stopped the monthly cash leak and sponsored Wilford in Uganda with my new found cash load – it’s much better. Just makes me wonder why 12Stone church in GA has a real live freak’n S’Bucks in their new bldg???? I’m just wondering that’s all.
Why can’t you enjoy the world God made, and the creative people who live in it, instead of condemning it? Does everybody you listen to have to be a Christian?
“Hey, I’m the electric guitar player at my church. Get off me!”
When did “honest” mean…mean?
The fact that I have to wear a skirt pisses me off…
We’re overprogrammed.
(And I’m the PK.:))
I’m so lonely and none of you make the effort to find out.
If I use my hooter hider, why can i breastfeed pretty much anywhere except in church (unless i go into what my husband calls the “milk parlor”)?
omgoodness, mine is totally “i suck at reading my bible” which sucks on so many levels.
There is nothing I have not mentioned in church. In the church we just left, my wife and I have been asked to not talk about our problems or our pasts, as it was ‘more real’ than the people were prepared to deal with.
It is only by speaking up that God can move people’s hearts to be authentic and real. It gives people ways to be used by God to help us grow. It provides opportunity to people to minister to us, and gives us opportunities to minister to others. Yes, there is risk. But the benefits outweigh the risks.
If we can not be ourselves with family, who can we be real with? And a church is supposed ot be a family. If its not, then change it – step out and be a sister or brother. If you suck at something, say so. If you don’t want to do something, say so and why. If you think the church should not support your pastor in ministering to people around the world, say so – it will at best give opportunity for the leaders to focus more attention on helping you realize that God has raised up men and women who love Him and who are fulfilling His Great Commandment.
Its a matter of discipleship, and trust in Christ, and obedience to Christ.
I’m homeschooled, normal, kick ass and am glad my parents chose that path.
PS, eat a chubby one.
Anne,
A fabulous topic! Thank you for asking again.
I have a problem with the letters. f….*….c….#
Understand why I won’t feel comfortable saying this in church?
Yet, I have and my conservative baptist congregation has been offended.
In context I was sharing a bad dream, a nightmare actually, I experienced. It was possibly a spiritual attack I had where I could not speak or move. I was asleep but it didn’t feel like I was asleep, I felt and heard frightening sounds. I felt like my hands were bound and my body was paralyzed. Finally , I whispered in my dream, “fuck you satan” Then louder and stronger I spoke, “Jesus is my strength” and instantly woke up!
In context I think, feel, and believe this is an appropriate use of the word even from a pulpit.
What do you think?
WOW who is D and God bless him or her for being honest and real. That is WHAT NEEDS TO BE SAID TO THE CONGREGATION YOU LEAD.
It’s real and honest and exactly how EVERYONE else is feeling and pretending to feel, do and act like you are ACTING.
YIKES.
I am praying you will open up to a small group within your church first and then possibly one day when the season is right the entire congregation.
God bless.
This isn’t a sin. It’s called a spiritual attack from satan.
Stay faithful as a small mustard seed!
D,
Maybe this will help.
http://danamj79.blogspot.com/
This is me. Best to read in chronological order from June 2008 to present.
“I’m not in ministry full time”
Aren’t all believers in ministry full time?
:-)
D,
Again, read your post three times.
I hear you.
I feel you.
I’ve been hospitalized three times in the last two years.
I’m 29.
I never had these problems until I moved from a huge metro area in the Northeast to a small southern town.
Bi-polar and paranoid schizophrenic are my “medical” diagnosis.
How can I be delusional if I believe in Jesus and therefore believe satan attacked me? How is it a delusion if I believe it to be real?
I called 911 because I was afraid of the dark. I was Baker acted into the psychiatric hospital because I told the cop to prove he was a cop and not satan. I told the cop if he was satan I would kill him. I was taken from my apartment when I called 911 and forced into the hospital, then got fired from my job for it.
WHAT IS THIS WORLD COMING TO?
In Isaiah’s time, what would they have done for the three years he walked around in his undies prophesizing? Truly, how can we just medicate and say, it’s not a message from God, it’s not satan attacking you…..
HOW IGNORANT ARE WE?
HAVE ANY OF US EVER READ OUR BIBLE?
DO WE REALLY THINK GOD HAS COMPLETELY CHANGED HOW HE COMMUNICATES?
I don’t know, do you?
Psalm 34
Of David. When he pretended to be insane before Abimelech, who drove him away, and he left.
1 [a] I will extol the LORD at all times;
his praise will always be on my lips.
2 My soul will boast in the LORD;
let the afflicted hear and rejoice.
3 Glorify the LORD with me;
let us exalt his name together.
4 I sought the LORD, and he answered me;
he delivered me from all my fears.
5 Those who look to him are radiant;
their faces are never covered with shame.
6 This poor man called, and the LORD heard him;
he saved him out of all his troubles.
7 The angel of the LORD encamps around those who fear him,
and he delivers them.
8 Taste and see that the LORD is good;
blessed is the man who takes refuge in him.
9 Fear the LORD, you his saints,
for those who fear him lack nothing.
10 The lions may grow weak and hungry,
but those who seek the LORD lack no good thing.
11 Come, my children, listen to me;
I will teach you the fear of the LORD.
12 Whoever of you loves life
and desires to see many good days,
13 keep your tongue from evil
and your lips from speaking lies.
14 Turn from evil and do good;
seek peace and pursue it.
15 The eyes of the LORD are on the righteous
and his ears are attentive to their cry;
16 the face of the LORD is against those who do evil,
to cut off the memory of them from the earth.
17 The righteous cry out, and the LORD hears them;
he delivers them from all their troubles.
18 The LORD is close to the brokenhearted
and saves those who are crushed in spirit.
19 A righteous man may have many troubles,
but the LORD delivers him from them all;
20 he protects all his bones,
not one of them will be broken.
21 Evil will slay the wicked;
the foes of the righteous will be condemned.
22 The LORD redeems his servants;
no one will be condemned who takes refuge in him.
The D I’m referring to is post 204
“I don’t want to go to church and have to be the pastor to that annoying kid today.”
Sometimes I want to raise my hand in the middle of the sermon and say “Ummm, excuse me…I’m not following ya here.”
“Hey you stop complaining about our church or find another, You dont even understand how it all works, maybe you should ask instead of being mad they dont ask\want you too sing!” (honestly your not that good anyways)
Honestly, a good chunk of these comments SHOULDN’T be said in church, or iin a Casino, or anywhere. They’re rooted in bitterness, which undermines and defiles the body of Christ. I don’t think Anne’s intent here was airing dirty laundry or fantasizing about tearing petty strips off people who’ve hurt us. I think she was intending this to be about transparency while upholding the rule to speak the truth in love.
I think the Lord is grieved with our bitterness.
I can’t talk to my parents about anything of depth. It makes me feel extremely uncomfortable and nauseous. They don’t know me at all.
Worship Takes Balls People.
Now Grab Them And Sing Like You Mean It
I don’t enjoy going to church anymore.
If you’re not married at my church, you’re just considered a workhorse that is easily replaceable.
When did preaching a sermon series over a movie become ok instead of preaching the Bible?
that the greatest scam in recent history is republican party’s use of the buzz words “abortion” and “the gay agenda” to convince most of us to turn a blind eye to every other issue.
http://bmccoy.wordpress.com
i smoke a pack a month. i am on staff at a church. i am married, but i think i might be gay. but i cant talk to anyone….so i will continue to stay quiet.
Did any of us… myself included… consider that maybe it isn’t the church’s problem that we feel like we can’t say these things?
It’s gnawing at me that there are more than 3x the number of comments from people about complaints and “what’s wrong with…” than prayer offers or requests. Something’s out of balance there . . .
on sunday i said…”ma’m, i can see your panties, please pull your pants up”
let the criticism begin. here’s a clue….the un-churched guy next to me asked me to tell her….for his wife.
now, let the criticism begin again
I’m sorry, did anyone have any ideas of how to change the problems they face, or do we really believe that it is helpful to throw rocks at the church and rail on people?
Cry about it. that’s what I have to say.
barge – i agree, they can pull their pants up
that was easy
Some of you should WISH these posts were the rantings of bitter, angry petty people.
Some of them could be, but my gut feeling is that most (if not all) of them aren’t.
They’re observations rooted in the reality of what the church here in America is – a flawed, imperfect group of people affected in various ways by the other flawed, imperfect people they interact with daily by those in and outside of the church.
We need a revolution in the church – one that comforts the broken-hearted, the wounded, the hurting, instead of leaving them to the non-mercies of the power-hungry megachurch pastor wannabes or the young pastor types modeling their ministries after worldly MMA fighters instead of a humble carpenter from Nazareth.
Yeah. But see, the thing is, one of the reasons we’ve got so many broken-hearted, wounded, and hurting people in the church is that people are spewing venom at each other in the name of transparency. Samples from above:
“That comb-over really does need to go.”
“Get a Frick’n clue”
“So how much are we going to pay you for this therapy?”
“that song sucked”
“Your church sucks.”
“I wish the lady in front would just stop breathing in general.”
“your kid is REALLY starting to piss me off.”
“a certain staff member is a real @$$%*!#”
”man, I’m so glad I’m not you”
“Grow the hell up and quit whining like a baby”
PS, eat a chubby one.”
Don’t get me wrong. I’m a pastor and I scanned through all of these. And there are some beautiful confessions. And some really destructive arrows being shot. How could people EVER feel safe sharing their innermost feelings if there are people waiting to say all these fleshly things to them?
We are the problem. Not just “them.” Us. Me. YOU.
I don’t think there is anything that I want to say but can’t (key word being “want”). There are things that I shouldn’t say, which is mostly what I’m reading here.
I think the only way to air all of this allows us all as the CHURCH to see our short fallings. I think you gotta be willing to take the criticism and I don’t think they are all fleshly things being commented on here. I think they are human things….fleshly to me terms it as bad, where as I don’t believe every part of being human is a bad thing.
I think people need to learn how to make people safe by not attacking the accusation and becoming defensive, but by looking introspectively (which most christians have a hard time doing…including myself) and saying, “What is not working here?” I think if we were willing to do that with the criticism than it would make throwing arrows a lot harder because our target would be smaller.
People who are defensive walk around with a big arrow on their backs. I also think though that Christians use their faith as a crutch to say, “You hurt me” rather than looking at the statement and saying “You’re right” or “You have not right to say that” We should be standing up for something not just shrugging away saying, “because you/me are christians we get hurt easily and aren’t willing to fix anything because the most important currency is not excellence, its relationships.”
Why can’t we have both? Isn’t helping one another through our short fallings helping each other to become excellent?
The one thing that I ask all the time is:
“Why do we need those digital signs, that enclosed walkway or that rotating stage that we are raising 6 million dollars for? Can’t we take some of that money and start a ministry to someone?”
or this one:
“Why is it that we have one of the largest auditoriums in the area (5500 capacity) but we never use it? Doesn’t anyone realize that there is a generation of young people out there that are listening and watching stuff that is straight up crap? It’s candy coated, but it’s still crap. Let’s use this space that we have to change the way people see media”
or this one:
“Let’s take that aforementioned 6 million dollars and open a training facility for people to work in media… music, photography, movies, website design, etc. and show the world that as Christians, we can do really cool things without being too churchy or cheesy”
Rotating stages are cool, but an impact on the media industry would be way cooler!
“You and your brother both woke up next to a gay asian guy this morning.” Whoops already said that one.
The one thing that really bothers me is when did “vests” become cool to wear on stage esp within the worship team? Its like one gets passed around and someone different wears it every week. I don’t understand
I’m smart than you… no, really.
I HATE THAT MY BLACK SON GETS LOOKED AT STRANGE WITH HIS WHITE WIFE AT HIS ALL WHITE CHURCH. LET’S STOP ACTING LIKE THE WORLD CHURCH.
@ Brad,
I’;m the one that said ”man, I’m so glad I’m not you”. chill brother and quit throwing rocks my way (didn’t you have a little judgemental problem with that yourself?)
it was tongue in cheek, a little humor, a little side bar, a poke, a funny, and obviously easliy judged by a pastor – sre you buddy’s with BMCoy? ya’ll actually sound a lot like the same person
TONY,
I know you were being tongue in cheek. I do that too. Sometimes tongue in cheek hurts people, that’s all.
Re-read your last post… Honestly ask yourself what assumptions you’re making, whether its tone reflects a constructive bent. IE, “easily judged by a pastor” sounds pretty judgmental to me. That hurts. As a pastor, am I allowed to say that, or is saying, “you hurt me,” a “judgmental problem”?
But again, if this is what happens when we talk about how we feel, if people say “Chill, brother” when we’re offended and speak up, no wonder people don’t feel they can speak up. I won’t even respond to the other barbs in your post. You have proven my point better than I ever could.
@ tony.
i would love to be compared to someone like Brad.
I never thought that leaving a comment on a friends blog about what i feel like i CAN’T say in church would lead you to judge me on my own blog. Rather than making this blog a safe place to share, you instead clicked on my link, left me a very rude and distasteful comment based on something i felt like i couldn’t share in a church, or around most Christians, and then tell me via e mail to get over it.
You single handedly proved this blog’s purpose, YOU, my friend, are the reason that we can’t say these things in church or around other Christians.
I don’t know how to love God as much as I love others.
Honestly, people like Tony don’t frighten me away from saying something in love. The immediate lack of reception isn’t that big of a deal, and, frankly, is to be expected. What IS important is that no matter the reaction, he heard you. Unless the guy is just completely arrogant, he’ll sit on it for awhile, and most likely realize his error.
I had a discussion last week with some people about confrontation, and how to do it lovingly.
@ Brad, you seem to have a genuine sense of care and a desire for the betterment of the church instead of just a desire to take out your frustrations like I have done so often.
@ Tony, it might be smart to step back, lessen yourself, and learn something from Brad.
http://weatherford.wordpress.com
I will smack the next person who tells me God is my husband.
I will smack the next married woman who tells me God is my husband five times.
I find 99.9% of contemporary christian music lame, depressing and uninspiring.
Beth Moore is annoying, superficial and impossibly skinny.
Amen to that Colorado girl!
amazing stuff –
snicker
@Brad’s comment: Honestly, a good chunk of these comments SHOULDN’T be said in church, or iin a Casino, or anywhere. They’re rooted in bitterness, which undermines and defiles the body of Christ. I don’t think Anne’s intent here was airing dirty laundry or fantasizing about tearing petty strips off people who’ve hurt us. I think she was intending this to be about transparency while upholding the rule to speak the truth in love.
I think the Lord is grieved with our bitterness.
—————————————————————————–
I think people like Brad have a tendency to just pull the negative. I believe Anne’s post was things we couldn’t say in church…and I’m going to add what I thought her reasoning was behing this post (I think it’s because of bitterness that people feel like if they were to say anything, they are a “bad” Christian. I think in fact, all of us are just normal people that have opinions. I think the church is a family…and usually when there is a family issue it needs a discussion. But, what the Church doesn’t allow is for there to be bitterness (out of being hurt), or resentment (for being overlooked) or questions (about leadership)…..thus the comments about “bitterness”
I think where we need to go with all these posts is :
What are we doing about our frustrations….if we are working to change them (whether in ourselves or our ministries) is it effective? Are we just complaining or are we really proactive about our true concerns and making an effort to correct those thing.
All families are run differently, but the Church is expected to run as a unit (this is hard because we all have different thoughts and ways of doing things). Let’s take these as a comments/questions/suggestions section and do something with all this material!
I agree with your last two paragraphs, wholeheartedly.
Is there any truth in my post, Lisa? If there is, you’ve just done what you said “people like me” tend to do – pull the negative instead of pulling the positive.
“People like you” statements like the one you lobbed at me are pretty demoralizing. I’m actually an optimist, but I’m also a pastor, with a heart for others – and have seen good people ripped to shreds by folks “Just being honest.” I’m continually working to help my congregation become more transparent, but that goes hand in hand with caring and love, or its deadly.
I should also say that MOST of this threads comments are genuine, searching, and honest. But nitpicking about Beth Moore’s physique seems immature to me, the kind of thing that tears down the body of Christ, not building it up. Still, maybe I overstated the scope of the negative here, and for that I’m sorry.
Let’s remember Paul’s words: “Each of you must put off falsehood, and speak truthfully to his neighbor, for we are all members of one body…” SO yes, be honest… but, “In your anger do not sin…” acknowledging we must be careful with our honesty, especially when we’re hurt or angry about something.
He goes on to say, “Do not let any unwholesome words come out of your mouths, but only what is helpful for building others up according to their needs, that it may benefit those who listen.” There’s the bottom line. Or wait, is it? Nope. “Get rid of all bitterness, rage, and anger, brawling and slander, along with every form of malice. Be kind and compassionate to one another, forgiving each other, just as in Christ God forgave you.” (Ephesians 4:25-32).
All I’m asking is that we watch our hearts, and our words, as we speak truthfully in love. Even in your reply, Lisa, you made a huge value judgement about me that was not helpful. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt, though; you probably didn’t realize that’s what you were doing. And I forgive you regardless.
Peace!
I don’t believe Jesus is the only way that God provided for people to be re-connected to him. I think God is “bigger” than that…
@Brad
I don’t know you, I just have to gauge the comment. For me, it’s pretty much what I thought. You got on your high horse and said, “Don’t worry, you probably didn’t realize that’s what you were doing and I forgive you.” If you needed to forgive me, I hope that you felt better for saying that.
I guess I have been in a lot of church situations. And when people tell me it’s ok, I forgive you and there hasn’t even been a conversation about defining the issue between those people, I don’t see why someone would “grant” forgiveness. That automatically places you in a role of superiority, which is how your first post came across to me. I was merely responding to your comments about gauging others anger about situations.
I tend to agree with you on catty/petty statements such as these:
“That comb-over really does need to go.”
“I wish the lady in front would just stop breathing in general.”
”man, I’m so glad I’m not you”
“Grow the hell up and quit whining like a baby”
But the following (one of many others) I thought was a decent thing to bring up:
“that song sucked”
Granted, its not about the song, it’s about the worship experience, but I think our churches lack excellence and so there were many comments about those very things. Sure, it’s an opinion, but its blunt. If someone had said “I don’t care for the songs we sing in church” it’s the same thing, just said more tactfully…and I didn’t think tact was necessarily part of the intent of the post.
Everyone reacts and acts differently when they’re hurt, angered, resentful, scared, and so it was interesting to me that you felt the need to tell people HOW they should be hurt, angered, etc. based on the comment regarding bitterness and how God probably grieved by it. Sure he’s probably sad we treat one another certain ways, but I think he’s also saddened because we don’t ALLOW ourselves as people to experience true hurt, pain, anger, etc. because we put this cap on it and say it’s bitterness and not acceptable. Then we say we should be all better becaue God heals us. This isn’t true. THe hurt is still there and so if we don’t struggle through it how are we to get over it. I think God grieves just as much for us in this situation as the one you mentioned. If we don’t allow ourselves and others to heal….we cannot be productive for the Lord.
I just went through this very situation with a past church and people think you’re nuts because it takes so long to get over the hurt, but they don’t know your situation. I WAS BITTER, I WAS HURT, I WAS SCREWED in so many ways, and I mean, sometimes ya just need to vent….regardless.
Not trying to pick a bone with you…..just a response….. but I do have my thoughts and instead of word-smitthing everything since we don’t have a real person-to-person conversation we have to say “people with that view of things” and since you made the comment your name got attached to it.
Cheers
Laura,
I understand your concern for those who don’t come to Jesus, but can you accept a “bigger” God who says Jesus is the only way in the Bible and then contradicts Himself ?
I think both mainline political parties suck and neither represent my faith in any way.
You can sing a song in church if I can set up a giant gong and hit it if you are terrible.
I read science fiction novels more than I read the Bible.
I don’t care what Calvary Chapel you used to attend. This one isn’t like that one, so get over it.
I’m a really good Bible teacher. There are a lot of guys in my fellowship of churches that are practically useless in the pulpit.
Why don’t you just go to (local Acts 29 church) next week? You’re going to end up there sooner or later anyway.
I went to the theater all by myself last week and saw Appaloosa. I don’t care that it’s rated R. I liked it.
I love Arrested Development
Build a bridge and get over it.
so Brad, the pastor….
Lisa is correct, this post was about things you can’t say in church…some are mean, some are hurtful and probably never should be actually said
…and some of them are heartfelt and it’s a shame they can’t be said
but you have misssed all that and moved to judgement in a really broad way – for example my comments were purely on a humorous level – not even close to serious (except the request for the lady to pull up her pants at church) – but you missed it all and that’s really just fine because you can’t ’see’ or ‘hear’ humor on here – you just see the words
the problem is you, thru a trap that was laid by me, fell right into it …..i love to throw stuff out and watch people react their socks off and get all holy about how bad a person i am and how everyone that gets near me will go straight to hell, etc
and you stepped right up and did your pastoral job by saying that i am the reason that people can’t say what they want in church-
mr pastor, most everyone on here totally discounted my crazy comments (except you and drummer boy who obviously takes obama too seriously to see humor, too) but not the pastor – the pastor rushed to condemn and rushed to judge others
now that the experiment is near completion it might be said that maybe the reason people don’t say what they think in church is, you guesed it, the pastor’s condemning nature or even maybe a worship leaders’ attitude
just my opinion – but you may want to reset your rock thrower for someone else for qwhile
love ya man, and good luck with your ministry – you definitely have good gifts and good things to give, as does drummer boy
@ Tony, I didn’t ever say it was people like you that make it impossible to share. I said,
“if this is what happens when we talk about how we feel, if people say “Chill, brother” when we’re offended and speak up, no wonder people don’t feel they can speak up.” So I didn’t judge you. I judged your actions, which were hurtful to me. Several others agreed with this, btw, and not all pastors, and not just drummer boy.
Ask yourself whether sitting around playing mind games with others, in your words, laying traps for them to fall into, then jumping on them when they apparently do, is hurtful or productive. This is called being a divisive person in my books.
@ Lisa,
I think you’ve hit a good point – there is a world of difference between what a person feels inside – the hurt – and how we respond to that hurt. People need time to heal, work through their issues, etc. I agree. What we also seem to both agree on is that hurting someone else in the midst of the situation isn’t helpful, it just widens the wound.
Something you should also know is that pastors are often the most wounded people in any given church, mostly because people feel free to launch venom at us in the name of transparency. So this is no high horse, friend, this is the valley, and I’ve walked it.
And yes, if you hurt me, it’s my responsibility to express my hurt to you and forgive you, which I did. My forgiveness of you isn’t dependent on your response. So I don’t need you to acknowledge what you said was hurtful – it was, I was hurt by it, however tiny the hurt – but it’s my duty to forgive as Christ forgave me. It helps if you see what you’ve done to hurt me, but I can move on regardless. Not a high horse. The call of Christ.
You don’t have to say “People like _________,” btw. that’s a sweeping generality, putting people in the kind of box that you wouldn’t like to be put in yourself. For example, you wouldn’t like me to say, “Oh, you’ve been wounded, have you? Well, bitter, wounded people like you are always so …” That would be hurtful, and would minimize your wound by putting you in a box. Unfair, right? I think so.
Peace,
Brad
And yes, @ Tony, now I guess I just “judged” you. Not out of anger, mind you, but sadness. It wasn’t to hurt, or to prove your point, but because the games you play are divisive and I can’t believe that’s the kind of person you’d want to be. Or that you’d want to hurt me back. If you’d done all this privately, I’d address you privately. But I forgive you for those games, even as its affected me and others here. You are loved, Tony. What I probably should have said was, “those actions are divisive,” though Paul does talk about “a divisive person,” in his Epistles. Sounds like judgement too.
Interesting how even forgiveness has taken a beating here, isn’t it? Sigh… I’ll keep my mouth shut now, as I seem to be fodder for some of the fire.
“This is called being a divisive person in my books……..”.
i asked you to put down rhe rock thrower, but i guess not. that’s Ok, go for it
gee, even gave you a compliment and still get a rock – don’t feel sorry for me, i have no need for it so you’re waisting your time – spend the time on your flock
@ Brad.
I agree with you here:
“I think you’ve hit a good point – there is a world of difference between what a person feels inside – the hurt – and how we respond to that hurt. People need time to heal, work through their issues, etc. I agree. What we also seem to both agree on is that hurting someone else in the midst of the situation isn’t helpful, it just widens the wound.”
ME: I would never advocate an attack on someone to promote healing. (especially if you didn’t know the person and if they weren’t really the one that hurt you)
I also agree:
“Something you should also know is that pastors are often the most wounded people…. So this is no high horse, friend, this is the valley, and I’ve walked it.”
ME: I am a recipient of this very situation (I use to say victim, but that seems helpless and I’m not) My father was a pastor for many years and how it ended wasn’t pleasantly, but it wasn’t just the ending, it was the journey that took the most out of our family. People don’t treat their leadership like they are people…they treat them like celebrities (which breeds the chaos of idolization but also de-personalization of a pastor, PK, etc.)
I did however feel like you needed to state that you forgave me to symbolize this for the entire forum,….I just tend to view forgiveness on a different playing field (not a different level mind you) just a different perspective. When I forgive someone and there is no resolve to the situation (because He did not call us to reconcile, but to forgive) then to me, I just keep that understanding of forgiveness between me and God. I guess it did seem like a high horse situation in my mind….but we digress.
Good thoughts, Lisa.
Have a good day.
…I don’t like anyone at church. None of them are my friends. I hate going to church and no one coming and talking to me. Am I invisible? Maybe its my responsibility to do that, to take initiative…but im A VISITOR STILL. I HATE this superficial worship and this American individualistic attitude.
David @ 318 -
Nope.
That’s the point of why I wouldn’t say it in church. If you’re in church, it’s assumed you think that Jesus is the only way. If I don’t, cause it doesn’t make sense to me, then I either don’t go to church or I just keep my mouth shut.
The point of this thread was, I believe, to say the things you’d never say in church.
I’d never say it there even though it’s the truth.
The thing I would have to say is sometimes I feel like church staff members really don’t care about getting to know me because they’re too busy trying to get noticed or be cool.
As a former youth pastor, I think I have a right to say this. Thanks for letting me get that honesty out, Anne. You rock.
We are all broken and there isn’t enough grace coming from the church.
1. I need help. Will you help me?
2. Do you need help? No? Are you sure?
3. No really, you can tell/trust me. You don’t have to talk to my pastor/youth pastor/elder/church marriage counselor/the cop in the foyer/Jesus/anybody but me…
You aliens make good mirrors. It’s what yer best at. Don’t ever change. Oh, this little darkness of mine, I’m gonna keep it hidden…what? That’s not how the song goes? (grin)
We spend too much time trying to walk a straighter line and not enough time humbling ourselves and reaching out to others.
I would tell my community: “I like to feel important. Your opinion matters to me. I want you to think I’m cool. I worry about what you think of me…probably too much.”
I don’t like that I like to feel important. But I do.
I am on staff at my church
I hate when I say “Oh Crap” or “That pissed me off” I get dirty looks.
I don’t tithe 10% to the church but split it up to people in need, someone I want to bless, and the church. I sometimes think I get overlooked for promotions because of it.
I have seen the church end of the year budget. report…shame on you Pastor______!
I hate to say I am a Christian…but I love to tell people what Jesus did in my life.
I love working in the service for the King..I hate working for “Organized Religion”
I don’t think I will ever send my children to a christian school.
I sometimes resent graduating from a christian college.
I take notes in church or else I get distracted or fall asleep.
Sometimes during quiet time i just sit and don’t pray or read my Bible…I just listen to God speak to me.
I don’t like Small Groups. I think they are hokie!!!
I could keep going…but I have said plenty…
Good Night! God Bless! and Remember Jesus will never let you go!!!!
today’s sermon – i am better than you because i create ways to forgive you for things you haven’t even done”
It makes me angry when you wear low cut shirts to church and elsewhere to show off your fake boobs. I know you are doing it because you are insecure and it makes you feel better about yourself when my husband and other men stare at you. I think it’s extremely disrespectful to me and other women. Do you even think about how it hurts me when my husband stares at your chest? Do you even care?!!! PLEASE cover up! I realize my husband is responsible for his looking but you need to think about what you are doing too. It hurts.
@ tony
you’re one sneaky kid. man, i tell ya. WHOA!!! fell right into that one.
seriously dude? laying traps? you are a part of the problem.
and you fell deeply into it ,also
you guys are such wimps – way too sensitive – therefore, you are the problem
1) stop alliterating. it sucks and i don’t like it.
2) i don’t care if you don’t like the worship song. if i did then i would be worshiping YOU
3) stop raising your hands in worship if you’re not going to pay attention during the message
4) stop being so scared to do something. it’s like you don’t believe you have the power of God inside of you.
5) if i didn’t know you would talk bad about me, i might tell you about my problems
6) can you worship with a piano and organ just as well as you can with electric guitars, fog machines, and lights? if no, you’re a selfish worshiper.
Parents….grow up and be parents!
recently, while i was teaching i paused and thought, “i shouldn’t have eaten that breakfast burrito.”
in that moment, i could have shared it with the rest of the church in spirit of authenticity, but then again, there is such thing as TMI.
jason salamun’s last blog post..In the End
alliteration always assumes absolute accuracy about almost anything abstract and above all, allows acute apathy all around
- When churches preach to “love the sinner, hate the sin” in regards to homosexuals, it sounds to me that they’re giving a free pass to make homosexuals feel like second-class citizens. And if they’d bother to actually SPEAK to someone who is gay, they might come to find that it’s not a choice, but genetics in control of this. I don’t understand how a church can say Jesus loves ALL, so you are all welcome ere. Oh, but not if you’re gay.
(Oh, and I’m a straight woman and this passionate – imagine how those silenced gay people feel.)
I feel like I cannot say in church that we elevate the American flag and patriotism more than we do the Kingdom of God. The marriage of the flag and the Bible is not something we want to encourage (I learned this from Rob Bell) and he is exactly right on. I am not anti-american, I just think that churches need to focus their light on the gospel and on Jesus Christ and not on any country, flag, political position, etc. Wow I feel better – thanks Anne!
Matt Nash’s last blog post..Graduation!
I’ve worked for a Christian organization for almost 20 years. I haven’t been to church in years because I just got disgusted with it all. I spend enough time dealing with everyone else’s idea of who I’m supposed to be during the week; I don’t want to deal with that on my weekends, too. I get really tired of the pretense.
I don’t want to join some small group and try to fit in. Been there, tried that. I no longer believe there’s an actual place for me with any group of people. I spend most of my time feeling orphaned by God and humanity. .
It’s the little things that pile up and avalanche.
How sad that I feel more free with my non-Christian friends.
Fascinating material.
@tony: given the biblical material on how to treat ‘weaker’ brothers, do you feel you could have reached your goal more productively if you had not laid traps, etc?
Reading all these comments, I am grateful that I can be completely honest with my pastor and the other deacons and most in the congregation; knowing that this is not the norm will, I think, cause me to cherish our church’s honesty and openness all the more.
Lawrence’s last blog post..Israel: Did you know?
@Michelle,
Curious as to what didn’t happen in small groups that you felt should have?
Lawrence’s last blog post..Israel: Did you know?
That I wonder how many of these people here will actually go to heaven…who is here for the show, the cute boy in the pew in front of them, the handout, the glory of being a great singer, the pride of serving….i don’t know…jesus said the path was narrow and few would find it…After I read Francis Chan’s Crazy Love…I looked at people in the church so differently like, who is really getting this? what we’re here for?
In no particular order…
- that we should stop talking about the joy God gives us if we sing “Victory in Jesus” like we’re at a funeral…if we can’t show it, we don’t have it
- that those cheesy Christian tshirts and Christianized popular music (ie. Apologetix) aren’t helping anything…pretty sure my God is worthy of something more original
- that I loathe Christian radio…I find myself seeing God more and more in “secular” music
- that some churches would be doing a greater service to God by just closing its doors…when staff members wouldn’t be comfortable inviting people and the pastor openly says he won’t schedule a revival for the reason of “I don’t think anyone would come” there is a serious problem
- that the Church is making a serious mistake by putting all our eggs in the anti-homosexual and anti-abortion baskets…I’m actually slowly working on a sermon (if I ever get to speak in church again…heh) ironically titled “Homosexuality – Your Sin is Bigger Than My Sin”
- that just because I don’t wear ties doesn’t mean that I’m less holy than you, or that I shouldn’t be taken seriously…and because I’m only 26 shouldn’t matter either
- that using Wednesday or Sunday night service or Bible study times to “practice” for any kind of a performance is the dumbest thing ever…we aren’t in church to learn to be entertainers…reschedule that crap
- that sometimes, reading the Bible pisses me off, because it shows me how inadequate I am (I actually said that to my youth group…surprised I never got a call from the pastor)
- that the biggest thing standing in the way of God being able to really move is the institutionalized church and its obsession with doing things by committee…too much wasted time
Ask for help, even in areas that I know I really need help & accountability, because it would reflect negatively on the church if we’re all not wonderful, perky, smiling and unblemished (especially physically), with every problem solved by tithing and giving extra.
heh … the alliteration references got me going and i am not going to resist the urge any longer: Alliteration assumes an ability actualized as an authentic act.
There … I feel better already!
Lawrence’s last blog post..Israel: Did you know?
I feel like quitting. (And I’m the Sr. Pastor.)
Wow, what a great question! Reading the comments is classic insight!
What I usually dont say out loud is: often I think the stuff we do and say at church is just plain corny. It doesn’t connect for me.
Art’s last blog post..Assumption #2
lawrence – that was 8 months ago – i totally forgot about it until you mentioned it.
check with pastor brad – but, he’s probably moved on, too – he has much better things to do, also
Things I’m Afraid to Say in Church:
- We probably evolved from monkeys. I don’t like it any more than you do.
- Most Sundays, I would rather be at home in my pajamas watching “Meet the Press” and Fareed Zakaria.
- I often feel like I have to choose between my faith and my intellectual integrity.
- The best sermon I ever heard was delivered by a woman.
- For me, accepting without question the notion that the majority of the human population will suffer eternal torment in hell for being born at the wrong place and the wrong time (or for not being among the elect) requires an emotional detachment I simply cannot muster.
- I suspect that people are born gay.
- Some days I think that God does not exist.
- I hate the expression, “God thing,” especially when it’s applied to something like a car or a vacation or a new pair of jeans.
- I’m afraid to tell you when I feel far away from God because I assume you will blame it on my “liberal theology.”
Anne – This post and the responses that have followed are truly eye-opening. Thanks so much for starting this important conversation.
Rachel H. Evans’s last blog post..Is Doubt a Disease?
1) i hate when we sing patriotic songs in church…Yesterday = the star spangled banner, and my country tis of thee
2) if the music minister can’t get songs right then he shouldn’t be leading worship
3) what are we doing?? as a church we are missing the boat
4) handbells? really?
5) i don’t like sunday school – i’m 25 and we have a college sunday school and a singles sunday school (40 and over)
6) just because your on vacation doesn’t mean we can be different people
7) it’s ok to not wear a suit to church
8) people who can’t sing should not be on the stage, the church does not = showtime at the appolo
9) i make mistakes too, i’m not perfect, and don’t think I am
thanks Anne,
great topic, a lot of stuff on here
I voted for Obama.
I think there should be civil unions for same sex couples.
The current state of the church makes me cry.
I hate mega-churches.
I can say anything at my church. I love Sandals!
That I want desperately to be a good Christian but have tremendous doubts about everything.
Nic’s last blog post..Faith
Hey, Anne! It was great meeting you yesterday.
Well… I have been known to make people angry at me because of the questions that I ask about church. So I don’t know that there is a ‘particular’ thing that would be an issue as much as my general problem with asking hard questions. I have found that many people who sit in church week after week have created a ‘fairy tale’ image of Christianity and they don’t want people chucking rocks at their Cinderella Castle version of what their faith is built on.
Tony York’s last blog post..Kissing with Eyes Open – Thoughts on meeting Pete Wilson
I feel pretty free to say whatever I want in church….of course I’m the Pastor. :)
However I aim for participatory services and try to make it free for anyone to say what is truly on their heart. One service I opened up to let people ask the tough questions that were on their heart.
Rick Apperson’s last blog post..CompassionArt – The Book
“Get off your @$$ and start loving people.”
“I have bipolar and I take medication for it. God still loves me, why can’t you?”
“You are a sinner too, you know.”
“Just because you don’t like the music/sermon/technology/leaders, doesn’t mean I have to agree with you.”
Jen C’s last blog post..An unexpected worship song
I am a normal person just like you.
Often I don’t feel like I’m close to God at all.
I’m a missionary, often I can’t seem to get off people’s pedastal long enough to say this and have them get it.
Wow, what an eye-opener reading these was!
I’ve been blessed. I’ve loved the churches I’ve attended, and loved and respected the ministers. But I once got landed on very hard for suggesting the conservatives weren’t doing enough “love and help their neighbors.” Boy, was saying that heresy in that church! The pastor and his wife let me know in no uncertain terms all Christians HAD to be conservative, or they weren’t Christian.
I’d just like to ask: what was Jesus? A conservative? A liberal?
The Bible’s answer is clear: NEITHER. The liberals fell short on loving God. The conservatives failed to love and help their neighbors. Both sides rejected him. He argued a lot with both, but, if my son’s thesaurus is right, a lot more with the conservatives than with the liberals.
I’d love to see us all learn from that. Be people who love God. AND who love each other, and LOVE AND HELP all our neighbors. (And don’t tear each other apart in blog comments). Not even just love “as we love ourselves,” though that’s great. But, as Jesus said in John, “love each other as much as I (Jesus) love you.” And take that seriously.
Does anyone really do that? Well, none of us are perfect, maybe not even close. But Dino Rizzo’s “Servolution” church gives us a pretty good example. So do Compassion, World Vision, and others.
And you know what? When we try doing that, even imperfectly, an awful lot of this other stuff suddenly doesn’t seem so important.
While I’m sure Jesus loves your new mega-gym and giant church campus, there are people starving that could have been fed.
That ministry would be great if it weren’t for whiny people who think that my life is supposed to be perfect, who won’t get off their duff and serve and why do I have to dress up for church? Where in the Bible does it say “thou shall dress in a fancy outfit to impress others?” And yes, ministers have bad days too!
The Christian life is not as complicated as we try to make it out to be. That’s what got the Pharisees in trouble with Jesus and I’m afraid we follow their example more than we follow Jesus. How do you convince the church that sometimes they do more harm than good?
Cindy’s last blog post..Relationships and Reese’s Peanut Butter Cups…
That if you are going to give a sermon on abortion, please have some compassion on the women that have had one. We deal with so much shame on our own, we don’t need you to put more on us. Saying abortion is like the modern day Holocaust makes me feel as if you are likening me to Hitler.
(hmm… I thought I posted last year. Must’ve been afraid to…)
Here goes:
1. I am sick of this obsession with having to be right all the time. A little humility could open up so many doors.
2. Is there anyone here who has the courage to truly dialog on matters of faith?
3. When will we see our gatherings as the reflection of our lives in Christ instead of the sum of our lives in Christ?
4. Um, I think you took that way out of context.
5. It’s okay and healthy to doubt.
I have been preaching/communicating for nearly 20 years and I feel sick, like throwing up sick, EVERY TIME I have to preach.
Randy Wood’s last blog post..UNPLUG
tony – thanks for the reply. amusing that my comment is 8 months out of sync with yours … this has been an interesting thread.
interesting, i think, that so many people who are (or claim to be) Christians are so self-righteous and self-centered. i kinda thought knowing (and becoming more like) the character of Christ would take one’s eyes off oneself …
Lawrence’s last blog post..Israel: Did you know?
Some of my Confessions: 1. I say that just because i’m dating someone doesn’t mean that I’m ready to get married tomorrow. 2. I always question if christians get married for love or just because they want to have sex without guilt or judgement. 3. I want to know why some christians persecute other christians when they fail but justify it when a “new christian” does the same thing. 4. (In terms of attire) I sometimes think that Sunday service reminds me of going to the club without the smell of alcohol or smoke. 5. I’ve been known to skip a service or two because I just wanted to stay home. Whew! Lol..that’s enough.
That my relationship with God isn’t making me want to stop cutting myself, and that every night I go to bed wishing, praying, that I won’t wake up the next day.
That I’m really scared because I don’t think that I can be helped except through death.
That the last straw was my best friend telling me that she has been distancing herself from me because she can’t handle seeing me the way that I am.
That I am alone because of how I have built myself, not because of other’s efforts.
@lawrence – i agree – and i’m guilty, too. i do really love the church and all the different styles, thoughts, passions, etc. the old stoggy church still reaches people (play that organ, dude), the mega-church (fix those lights, dude) still reaches people, the blonde highlight pastor (more gel, dude) church still reaches people, the bi-sexual woman in a robe ‘teacher’ (be more liberal, dude) still reaches people, and on and on….praise God they do, or at least try. i can’t and won’t knock ‘em for that.
@your name:
you are not at all alone. God loves you and wants to be there for you – let Him. Please call someone at a church – just pick one or stop as you drive by one – people will help you.
here’s a start – these are churches and orgs that can help:
(817) 924-4266
405-557-1777
1-800-273-8255
can a professional on here – ie PASTORS, etc. – provide a way for @yourname to contact you????
What’s that sound I hear? Oh, right: it’s rubber, hitting the road, with no judgment or condemnation …
Lawrence’s last blog post..Israel: Did you know?
“This isn’t working for me. Listening to you preach does nothing for me. Could you please take a second to notice that the individuals that make up your church are of varrying ages & at the very least acknowledge that.”
I’d much rather be at Starbucks enjoying a good coffee and reading the Sunday paper. I get pretty much nothing from coming to church, and usually see it as a boring drudgery. Oh yeah… I’m in full time “ministry.’
Do you really see me sitting here? Since people found out about my sin I have been treated different. I wonder really what God’s Grace is like.
The same forgiveness you preach about on the stage I wish I saw in your leadership team.
I sometimes wonder if I just got saved and didn’t grow up in the church I wonder if I would be treated different.
“Why aren’t you people, who claim to be saved, excited about what God does for us? What is wrong with you?”
Lawrence’s last blog post..Israel: Did you know?
i dont believe this stuff…
A lot of things but this would be where I might start:
I think a lot of things the church teaches with certainty are not that clearcut when you really start looking into scripture.
Liz’s last blog post..No Matter Who You Are – No Matter Where You Go
That I’m a lot more liberal than the default perspective in church, that it annoys me that we published an interview with our current Primeminister (because he has great ‘family values’… whatever) but never did that with our previous one – and she has the third top job in the UN now so is an amazing woman. Neither are Christian.
That I agree with the criminalising of using physical force on children – it doesn’t mean you go to jail for a light spank, but you can’t use ‘reasonable force’ as a defence for beating the crap out of your kids. It is not normal discipline and so many studies say it doesn’t work (we have a referendum coming up). I hate hearing spare the rod used as an example as to why it is good to discipline children this way – my own parents used that as a justification for their anger issues well into my teenage years (almost into my twenties).
That the smiling, happy couples can be the most lonely and isolating thing to view.
That I’d love some more quiet reflective time at church, we’re so busy being relevant and modern that we’ve gotten way too loud and fast paced.
kazzles’s last blog post..Another year older, another year wiser?
Don’t try to make me feel bad about watching rated ‘R’ movies. You have your standards and I have mine. As a matter of fact, as a filmmaker I feel called to make quality films and sometimes that means my characters will act un-Christian so just deal with it or watch something else.